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View Full Version : Playing SACD/CD on BDP9700 (2 ch only)



ktl
04-30-2013, 10:07 AM
Hi to all (owners and/or Philips support personnel),

Now I'm starting a new thread and hopefully someone will answer my question here.

I plan to buy a 9700 but kinda hesitate since I'm seeing so many issues related to SACD playing (especially with x.1 surround setups and with digital TV connection). I'm especially interested in playing SACD/CD on 9700 with a stereo setup: analog stereo L/R outputs (RCA) to amplifier; and analog TV to composite video output (RCA) (for unit setup and tracks monitoring and/or selection, as I don't know how much information the front panel gives). If I'm not mistaken, 9700 uses 24/192KHz DACs, so by design, I should hear PCM sound on the analog stereo outputs. Regardless of the problem of interrupted SACD playing with digital TV turning on or off (with firmware < 3.76), will I hear high quality full spectrum PCM stereo sound uninterrupted (all other channels downmixed to analog stereo L/R) when I play SACD/CD? There are no delta/sigma DACs, so I wouldn't be hearing DSD sound on analog stereo outputs, right?

Anyone knows what the differences among 9700/12, 9700/93 and 9700/98 are. Are they circuit board revisions or are they country specific? I'd noticed on some demo units, there's a jumper on the circuit board while there's none on others. If those numbers are board revs., I should avoid buying other numbers as I won't have chance to upgrade the firmware.

I hope someone will give me some idea before I go ahead and buy this product.

Thanks.
KTL

MrBarton
04-30-2013, 10:18 AM
Hi ktl, the difference between BDP9700/12, /93 and /98 is only depending on which country they are sold in, i.e. different power plugs. Nothing in terms of performance. There should be a few other threads discussing the SACD question, so I recommend you to search and you should be able to find other users and our experiences. ;)

ktl
04-30-2013, 11:47 AM
Thanks MrBarton for your quick response.

I surely can find very similar topics but I wonder if they are talking about analog 2ch L/R outputs in specific, but not analog 7.1 outputs configured to use front L and R only. And whether DSD is absolutely not possible to convert directly to analog on this unit.

I want to ask "Rin" in particular since he was talking about his 2 ch hi-end system.

Thanks again MrBaron.

Gerhard
04-30-2013, 01:38 PM
You might ask WillemV, who is normally around and did extensive tests with the device and SACD playback, also focusing on the analogue outputs. I'm still wondering that he's not replying but I think he's busy these days. So I guess you need to be somewhat patient...

Here (http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?11352-Playing-SACDs-on-a-9700&p=54785&viewfull=1#post54785) are the first tests from Willem, where he wrote something about the very good quality of the 7.1 outputs. You might find more information in this thread and please note that the issue with the SACDs stopping after each track is solved.

- Gerhard

ktl
04-30-2013, 05:31 PM
Thanks Gerhard, I hope WillemV will shed some light when he's available. Now with 3.80, I guess SACD playing is still not smooth sailing. I wonder if the sound dropping thingy is one time or persistent.

I'm still not certain if I'm buying 9700 or 103 (you know what I mean).

KTL

Rin
04-30-2013, 08:10 PM
@KTL: Do you have a spycam somewhere in my living-room or what?! I had the "103" and the BDP9700 here to compare! Played around with both for about a week, brought back the "103" and kept the BDP9700. To be honest, the choice was clear after just an hour or two. My first interest, just as yours, is 2ch sound quality, from CD, SACD or high-res FLAC 24bit 96/192kHz.

The BDP9700 is clearly much smoother, less harsh.

Main speakers:
Magnepan MG12 Planar-Magnetic (my favourites)
Dynaudio Contour S3.4
Klipsch RF7-II (just for fun)

The display on the BDP9700 does not give much information when playing CD or SACD. No "remaining track time" or any of that. Even more disappointing: When playing FLAC from USB you need to have the tv on to see what you are doing :( I think I'm gonna get a cheap Android tablet cause you seem to be able to control the player and browse the files with the Philips app. Still wish the display would be more multi-functional...

But every time I put on some high-res recording, be it classical or pop, I forgive this player all it's shortcomings because of it 's smooth sound. Gotta love that... :D

ktl
05-01-2013, 06:52 AM
Hi and LOL@Rin,

I ain't no spy. But Magnepan surely is hi-end stuff and so is Dynaudio. I had a chance listening to Apogee years ago and gee it sounded so great that I could hardly forget. You like 9700's sound, I trust your taste but I'm wondering if you experience the same sound dropping with SACD/CD as Gerhard. It would be quite annoying when you are immersed in a lovely piece of music and then all the sudden you get hiccups from the machine. By the way, I wonder which version (3.76 or 3.80) gives no/less sound dropping (I don't mean that's caused by turning on/off the digital TV as I am only using analog TV which doesn't deal with any HDMI connection).

Regards,
KTL

Gerhard
05-01-2013, 07:18 AM
Hi,

8...]I'm still not certain if I'm buying 9700 or 103 (you know what I mean).[...]

for sure ;) I thought a bit in the same way like you, although not having that hi-end equipment, but I wanted to have a multi-talent.
On the other hand, I already have a Philips TV-set and thought having a Philips BDP is a good idea. In fact it seems to me that the Philips hardware is pretty good and the firmware often enough a mess.
The sound drops for now seem to confirm that.

I won't recommend anything, especially after reading Rins comments. But also this confirms my thesis: good hardware, crappy firmware.

Cheers,
Gerhard

ktl
05-01-2013, 11:34 AM
I guess it doesn't hurt if I wait a while until this thing get more stable.

Please Philips, you are the pioneer in digital audio technology. We all have faith in you. You can do it !!

KTL

andrea_sacd
05-02-2013, 08:51 PM
hi everybody!
i'm just a little confused, maybe because english is not my language.
reading the other treads i've understood that while playing multichannel sacd has the problem that it plays only the multichannel part without the possibility to play the stero part.
But the answer of rin put doubt in my mind.
so with that configuration

hdmi main connected to tv
and
analog stereo connected to ampli

what will happen if i insert a multichannel sacd (for example pink floid dark side of the moon) ?
will it play only the multich part making me loose 4 channel? or in that case will play the stereo dsd part?
i hope the second, like the possibility to put 21:9 format only when connected to a 21:9 tv.

thankyou in advance

Toengel
05-03-2013, 06:31 AM
Hi,

there is no 21:9 aspect ratio spezification for HDMI - so no 21:9 output.

Toengel@Alex

Philips - QK
05-03-2013, 06:57 AM
Hi Alex,

For the 21:9 settings, andrea_sacd is right. 21:9 only available if you have a 21:9 TV. This is an auto-fit setting.

Kind regards,
Philips Moderation Team

ktl
05-03-2013, 08:01 AM
Hi,

I don't know how Philips design their players. Normally, you will have following:

(1) stereo L/R outputs (hardwired, not software configurable):

stereo source -> straight to L/R outputs
x.1 source ->downmixed to L/R outputs


(2) x.1 outputs (software configurable):

stereo source -> straight to Front L/R outputs, no sound on other outputs
stereo source -> Front L/R outputs (small loudspeakers) and .1 output (sub-woofer), no sound on other outputs
x.1 source -> straight to x.1 outputs
x.1 source -> downmixed to Front L/R outputs, no sound on other outputs

If the downmixing is working properly, no channel information will be lost . This is how my Kenwood DVD/CD player is designed.

andrea_sacd
05-06-2013, 08:25 PM
ktl> the problem is that seems that in the 9700 plays only the multichannel part, and i don't have a multichannel system (living in a room apartament), but maybe it do so only with the 7.1 analog exit and hdmi.
i hope someone can do this test, will be usefull for me.

ktl
05-07-2013, 06:56 AM
Hi andrea_sacd,

I was trying to say you will not lose any channel for downmixing x.1 to 2-ch. The player will combine all the channels on the left side giving you "Left" channel, while on the right side it's the same thing. For center and sub-bass channels, they will be split into two paths, one will be mixed with the "L" and the other with the "R". Thus you will end up with 2 channels only. All multichannel systems are doing the same thing. But for 9700, I'm not sure if the player is bug-free on this matter. I remember seeing other threads for 9500 or 9600? I don't recall exactly. There was an issue with missing sub-bass frequencies with downmixing.

KTL