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View Full Version : Philips and TPV to create strong television company



Toengel
04-18-2011, 07:43 AM
Hi,


Finding a solution for our Television business was out top priority and we strongly believe that the intended 30% / 70% joint venture with TPV that was announced today will enable a return to profitability for the Television business, and an increased portfolio focus for Philips in health and well-being. Philips has been active in the TV industry for many decades and the long-term strategic partnership with TPV shows our commitment to the continuity of Philips televisions for our consumers and trade partners.
The joint venture leverages the innovation and brand strength of Philips with the scale and manufacturing strength of TPV. Philips will receive a deferred purchase price and brand license income as part of the agreement. We expect certain costs in relation to the separation which will impact short-term earnings.

Source: http://www.newscenter.philips.com/main/corpcomms/resources/corporate/Q1_2011/R_1Q11.pdf

Toengel@Alex

Toengel
04-18-2011, 07:46 AM
Hi,

some more information: http://www.newscenter.philips.com/main/corpcomms/news/press/2011/20110418_tpv_jointventure.wpd

Toengel@Alex (Toengel@Alex)

petasis
04-18-2011, 08:37 AM
So, its final. They are selling their TV department to AOC...

carlosfm
04-18-2011, 09:43 AM
I'm worried.
AOC, based in Hong Kong...

Chrissie18
04-18-2011, 10:29 AM
I thought some people were stating that Philips was left behind bij the Chinese (or at least Asian) manufacurers.
Maybe now they can catch up with that.

I also read that they also agreed upon a date in which they determine if the branch is profitable again and regain the majority in the venture...

I just hope that this joint venture will not be resulting in less support for current models...

RenzoEllul
04-18-2011, 11:00 AM
What will happen to support? I am in the process to buy an LED TV now. If there will be no support on the present or to be released line up I will opt for an other brand.

smart
04-18-2011, 11:29 AM
I think, this will lead to a very important question. What happens with the feature open internet access, if Philips does not provide its proxy service?

If Philips closes its TV business, they won't provide NetTV any longer, but also the open internet access won't work if they do not provide their proxy any longer.

Hopefully this will only happen during my warranty time, if it will happen...

Currently it is not possible to change the provider of the proxy/NetTV service in the TV.

petasis
04-18-2011, 12:59 PM
Yes, this is a true concern. Net TV may stop in the future. And the fact that DVB-T EPG is not working, will leave everybody without a guide...

Franck78
04-18-2011, 03:40 PM
Hello,

@RenzoEllul

BUY now. Philips have stock of set to sold. They payback you 100/200/300 euros depending on the model.
Plus it will be made in Hungary/Europe, no doubt more quality than what will now come from china with a Philips sticker.

Probably the 2011 series will never reach us. Another good new. The dev team will focus on recent 2009/2010 series. I doubt they will move to china land.

Watch the price and buy ;-)

Franck

Toengel
04-18-2011, 03:57 PM
Hi,

Net TV will go on, since it is also part of Blu-ray players and HTS systems. And they won't be outsourced!!!

Toengel@Alex

petasis
04-18-2011, 04:12 PM
I believe that the 2011 models will be out, as supposed to. The new company will take over probably at the end of the year.
But they will probably be the last ones...

Franck78
04-18-2011, 06:46 PM
Only some people know this information Petasis.
-they loose money with that
-they have stock (see retour -300€ until end of april), in NL, in France
-they have a good reason to stop production now (japan supply failing)
and since today everybody is aware of Philips giving up.

Will you launch another model ?

On comparator websites, model are announced 'april 2011'. Really short to provide retailers. Probably the planning was this but the new chief put a stop.

If one day you open the service manual, you will find a circuit doing 99% of the job in the tv. It is the same for every set. It means that aparts physical connectors, 3D, more watts for sound, all enhancement are software essentially and probably a lot can be backported. If tomorrow they decide to provide 'timeshift' using the sd card, they can do it on 7605.

Just have to wait two weeks to see or not 2011 models ;-)

Bye
Franck

petasis
04-18-2011, 09:35 PM
Philips always released the good models (series 9000) just after summer. So, we have to wait until October to see them.

The fact that the brand name changes hands, does not mean that the production will stop, and will not see a new Philips TV. After all, the design, and demo products are already available, and have been demoed already. I am sure we will see them in the market.

Regarding the service manual, yes I have seen the one of my TV. It uses PNX85500, which is the main reason there is no local dimming in 3D. Since 9706 will have local dimming in 3D, it is going to have a different chip for sure. And code for the new chip, does not mean that it can run properly on older chip. For sure they can backport things to older models (provided they don't need hardware provided by the newer chips), but why to do this?

We are begging for DVB-T EPG for many months now (which is already implemented inside the TV) and they don't give it to us, or next/now. They are going to backport new features?

RenzoEllul
04-19-2011, 06:10 AM
Hi Frank

Well i wish i could opt for that option however locally i have to rely on the local Philips agent and thus i do not get the €300 rebate :( . I did try to see if i could get it from abroad but the amount of money I save is very limited indeed. Moreover the local agent has a very good reputation and I prefer a face to face communication with a person who can have a look at the TV if anything goes wrong and give me a replacement until it is fixed.

With respect to Net TV... well Philips is now part of a consortsium and personally i think it is the best internet TV option available right now since most of the other manufacturers have gone solo. Will they pull out of it... I doubt it.

2011 models... well I am waiting for these and I honestly hope they do arrive pretty soon... The 6 series is already out. I am looking forward for the 7 series. The improved NET TV functions, USB recording and the silver colured frame are the selling points for me... I did see the 2010 model which I would be ready to buy right now however I am ready to wait a few extra weeks.

I am still wary of the USB recording as this is heavily dependant on the internet provided EPG, which personally i do not like, however I read on the FAQs of Philips TVs that this option will be available in June. So there might be sufficient time to fix this issue!!! cross fingers!!!

Let's wait and see

ahasver
04-19-2011, 10:16 AM
So I suspect, unfinished device software will never finished. The costs of the "support" call centre would be cut, cause that is only creative in finding error responsibility not by Philips or claiming variants of sorry ...

dellamag
04-19-2011, 11:37 AM
If one day you open the service manual
Franck, could you please tell the link from where you took the service manual ? Thanks

Toengel
04-19-2011, 12:02 PM
Hi,

each chassis has his own manual...

Toengel@Alex

carlosfm
04-19-2011, 02:17 PM
The improved NET TV functions, USB recording and the silver colured frame are the selling points for me...

Look at what happened to Kodak's digital cameras.
No more "made in japan" full metal body with an OLED display (I had one).
Now you look at a Kodak digital camera and it seems like cheap plastic. Well... it is!

The darkish metal silver frame of Philips TVs, which I like too, will still be silver, probably.
But just painted plastic.
At competitive prices.

carlosfm
04-19-2011, 02:20 PM
Franck, could you please tell the link from where you took the service manual ? Thanks

He didn't, he said "one day".
I would pay to have the service manual of my 37PFL7605H/12. Can't find it anywhere, paying or not.

Franck78
04-19-2011, 05:23 PM
Hello,

Found some files here, sorry I didn't wrote the english version yet.
Also don't try the fast mirror, this 'temp' page is not linked.
Files are really big (40Megs) and adsl upload slow. Be patient ;-)
There is real diff between the two SM. Download only the one pertaining to you.

Bye

carlosfm
04-19-2011, 07:42 PM
Hello,

Found some files here, sorry I didn't wrote the english version yet.
Also don't try the fast mirror, this 'temp' page is not linked.
Files are really big (40Megs) and adsl upload slow. Be patient ;-)
There is real diff between the two SM. Download only the one pertaining to you.

Bye

Merci beaucoup!
But... this link doesn't work, this is what I'm after:

service manual des séries xxpfl5405 xxpfl5605 xxpfl6605 xxpfl7605

If you could fix it... that would be great.

Sam-ourai
04-19-2011, 08:02 PM
You can read here :
or d/l here :

carlosfm
04-19-2011, 09:27 PM
You can read here :
or d/l here :

Yes, I've found that too, but I can't download the file from there.
And the first link takes my CPU to 100%, it's unuseable to read the doc there.

carlosfm
04-19-2011, 09:33 PM
Gents, I've taken a look to the xxPFL9705 service manual and I must say that I'm very impressed.
The PNX85500 is an impressive chip. From NXP (Philips).

http://www.hotchips.org/archives/hc21/3_tues/HC21.25.600.SoC-Clocking-Epub/HC21.25.611.Osborne-NXP-PNX85500%20-%20Hot%20Chips%20Presentation%20-%20090825.pdf

Our TV sets are not just done by assembling parts from other manufacturers, it has Philips' own technology.

Now I just loved to have the xxPFL7605 service manual...

carlosfm
04-19-2011, 10:29 PM
You can read here :
or d/l here :

Ok, I've managed to download from the second link, using IE.
With Opera, it wasn't working...
Thanks.

Franck78
04-20-2011, 12:06 AM
Link fixed, sorry for typo error ;-)

@Carlosfm, the ancestor of pnx85500, pnx8500 was not to bad too :



With over 32 million transistors integrated into the chip, the pnx8500 is more complex than a Pentium-III processor. Priced at $48 in volumes of 100K units, it therefore offers unprecedented price/performance ratios for demanding interactive set-top box applications.

Philips
04-20-2011, 11:57 AM
We fully understand your questions about the coming Philips-TPV joint-venture.

Maybe we can answer already some of them:

Q: What did Philips announce and when?
A: Philips announced that it plans to enter a joint venture partnership for its Television business with TPV Technology. TPV is one of the largest manufacturers of Televisions in the world. Together they plan to become a major player in Television globally. They announced this news on Monday, April 18 2011.

Q: Why is Philips doing this?
A: Philips is doing this to create a stronger Television business. This partnership places Philips Television business at the core of an industry ecosystem, which has television and its components as its strategic focus. The joint venture will leverage the strength of the Philips brand, innovation power and trade relationships, with the additional scale and manufacturing strengths of TPV.

Q: Does it mean Philips is leaving the Television business?
A: No. It means Philips wants to make it stronger.

Q: Will Philips Television continue to be made? Will Philips continue to bring new ranges to the market?
A: Yes. Philips Televisions will continue to be made. Philips already launched a new range of Televisions in March and will have a new range in September.

Q: I own a Philips television does anything change for me?
A: No, nothing changes. The warranty, guarantee and support stay the same.

Q: I want to buy a Philips Television, does anything change for me?
A: No, nothing changes. Philips’ commitments in terms of warranties and guarantees will remain unchanged. Philips Television will continue with great innovation in picture quality, SmartTV (incl. Net TV) and Cinema proportion Televisions (like Cinema 21:9).

dellamag
04-20-2011, 12:01 PM
Download only the one pertaining to you.

Bye

Thank You, Frank78. This is really appreciated !

Toengel
04-20-2011, 01:13 PM
Dear Philips,

thanks for these clarifications!

Toengel@Alex

carlosfm
04-20-2011, 04:57 PM
Dear Philips,

Thank you for the clarification and for allowing us to share service manuals in your forum. :D

Freddy
04-21-2011, 01:30 PM
I'm glad to see these confirmations and I really hope it will all work out very well, for us loyal customers (I've never owned a tv other than Philips), as well as for you Philips guys! Keep up the good work and... make things better!... ;)

tolgaakcan
04-22-2011, 05:58 AM
Dear Philips,
Thank you for your explanation.. Consumer rights or brand may stay as you say.

Apearances, when an electronic giant to hand over %70 of their share to some other company instantly leaving the right to receive another %30 of the share in a few years time tells me things didn't work out too well for them.

I think there is some problem with the message of the Reuters. I do not perceived the way you have said.
Thanks..


We fully understand your questions about the coming Philips-TPV joint-venture.

Maybe we can answer already some of them:

Q: What did Philips announce and when?
A: Philips announced that it plans to enter a joint venture partnership for its Television business with TPV Technology. TPV is one of the largest manufacturers of Televisions in the world. Together they plan to become a major player in Television globally. They announced this news on Monday, April 18 2011.

Q: Why is Philips doing this?
A: Philips is doing this to create a stronger Television business. This partnership places Philips Television business at the core of an industry ecosystem, which has television and its components as its strategic focus. The joint venture will leverage the strength of the Philips brand, innovation power and trade relationships, with the additional scale and manufacturing strengths of TPV.

Q: Does it mean Philips is leaving the Television business?
A: No. It means Philips wants to make it stronger.

Q: Will Philips Television continue to be made? Will Philips continue to bring new ranges to the market?
A: Yes. Philips Televisions will continue to be made. Philips already launched a new range of Televisions in March and will have a new range in September.

Q: I own a Philips television does anything change for me?
A: No, nothing changes. The warranty, guarantee and support stay the same.

Q: I want to buy a Philips Television, does anything change for me?
A: No, nothing changes. Philips’ commitments in terms of warranties and guarantees will remain unchanged. Philips Television will continue with great innovation in picture quality, SmartTV (incl. Net TV) and Cinema proportion Televisions (like Cinema 21:9).

Philips
04-22-2011, 07:51 AM
Dear Philips, Thank you for the clarification and for allowing us to share service manuals in your forum. :D

Unfortunately we cannot support the (unofficial) spread of Service Manuals via this channel. Therefore we will remove the hyperlinks.

Franck78
04-22-2011, 10:14 AM
Unfortunately we cannot support the (unofficial) spread of Service Manuals via this channel. Therefore we will remove the hyperlinks.

But Philips can spread the official free open opensource existing codecs in 'my' tv and their forums ;-)
Let me handle other documentation less important.

Franck

Toengel
04-22-2011, 11:49 AM
Hi,

you can download the open source package for your TV...

Toengel@Alex

pdemo
04-22-2011, 06:51 PM
Hi,


Dear Philips,
I think there is some problem with the message of the Reuters. I do not perceived the way you have said.
Thanks..

No, you are right
30% for Philips et 70% for TPV
TPV is going to decide everything !

RenzoEllul
04-25-2011, 09:00 AM
Honestly I am not fully convinced. A possible scenario is that after the due diligence the agreement does not happen, so we are stuck...

Moreover there are a number of issues which have been highlighted in the forum which have never materialised... will these be fixed before the aquisition or after? My feeling is that once the takeover occurs the support for the existant models will simply be not existant.

It is very simple for philips to give re-assurance that support will be there, but the new owners will surely have a different opinion on the matter.... If one is to buy a new TV right now it would be best to stay away from Philips. Who knows, maybe in a couple of years time Philips will be a good company but right now it would be ideal to wait for the transition period to pass and then re-evaluate.

tolgaakcan
04-25-2011, 12:03 PM
I see there are concerns about what to do with our TV's. TPV will be a big share holder with %70 having the right of buying rest of the %30 that clearly suggests me that Philips hands over TV section.
I do not think we as customers will be effected as much...
After all TPV is unknown brand..
At least I don't know them...
So they are going to have to use Philips brand using same service centers.
So no need to panic..


I still don't understand how is a company like Philips taking such a sharp decision. They make great TV's.

Toengel
04-25-2011, 07:24 PM
I still don't understand how is a company like Philips taking such a sharp decision. They make great TV's.

Hi,

only good financial numbers count at the end... and since the TV devision wasn't profitable it was the only logical step for Philips...

Toengel@Alex

ahasver
04-28-2011, 03:02 AM
Philips Television will continue with great innovation in picture quality, SmartTV (incl. Net TV) and Cinema proportion Televisions (like Cinema 21:9).Now "SmartTV" seems to be the new promotion bubble of content business to confuse customers. But the hope in getting the full integration of HbbTV-standards as claimed last year will never come :(
Please first have a look in better implementing the basics of provider independent DVB-Standards and customer friendly organisation of larger channel lists.

Freddo
05-14-2011, 10:49 AM
I'm worried.
AOC, based in Hong Kong...
So am I. I fear the quality of the TVs will go down big time from using cheap chinese parts.

Back in 2006-2008 or so Samsung used cheap chinese capacitors (Samwha) for their TVs which significantly lowered the quality of their TVs. Many of them died and had to be repaired after only a year or two. Since then Samsung fortunately got smarter and now use high quality japanese capacitors in their TVs. But I would hate to see the same happening to Philips.

But having a TV breaking down after a year or two is unacceptable. Most people (non-tech geeks who don't get the latest and greatest all the time) expect their TV to last for at least a decade. Heck, my parents still have a 35 year old TV that still works (which also happens to be a Philips).

Kamran
06-19-2011, 02:57 PM
as Iranian fan of Philips i feel very bad about this news,
i cant understand why Europe peoples don't support they industry and this happen to their brands
why we must buy garbage from china and Koreans , bad quality, bad materials ,bad for health , they just using of plastic because they don't have iron mine in their country :D
its very bad , no more TV Production in Europe , and bad harmony and bad fashion designed from china and Korea i buy many Philips products from here Iran without any support and service center, because i believe in originality and quality of Philips, but in Europa peoples buy Samsung and LG because of their products is cheap
i hate Korean design and quality , i guess they will eat world very soon and they will attack to other brands like a Siemens
with all respect i fear for losing our choice to select our favorites brands ...
Sorry for my bad English

petasis
06-19-2011, 05:31 PM
My opinion about this is simple: we have lost respect for our jobs in Europe.
The issues in the past were a bad firmware update was distributed in Friday, and nobody cared enough to fix this until the weekend was over, is a sad indication of this...

The fact that they have never corrected even the spelling mistakes in the firmwares for a year now, is a second sad observation...

Philips
06-20-2011, 11:51 AM
as Iranian fan of Philips i feel very bad about this news,
i cant understand why Europe peoples don't support they industry and this happen to their brands
why we must buy garbage from china and Koreans , bad quality, bad materials ,bad for health , they just using of plastic because they don't have iron mine in their country :D
its very bad , no more TV Production in Europe , and bad harmony and bad fashion designed from china and Korea i buy many Philips products from here Iran without any support and service center, because i believe in originality and quality of Philips, but in Europa peoples buy Samsung and LG because of their products is cheap
i hate Korean design and quality , i guess they will eat world very soon and they will attack to other brands like a Siemens
with all respect i fear for losing our choice to select our favorites brands ...
Sorry for my bad English


Hi Kamran,

Thanks for your post. Great to hear that we also have fans/forum readers in Iran!

To elucidate a little on your remarks: Sad to see how our 'bad press release' has created such a distorted image.

Only the ownership changes, not the products or the people (in principle all current Philips TV employees will go over and will form the new company!).
- We continue to produce in Europe,
- We continue to design in Europe,
- We remain a European brand (with HQ in Amsterdam, the Netherlands).

Compare it with Volvo who is also half Chinese owned. Few people will point at a Volvo and say Chinese car!

Regards,
JuAn.

tolgaakcan
06-20-2011, 12:40 PM
Idon't think quality is entirely related to country or location. Philips made some of their goods in china. does it make it any worse. I think not..Investment always has a tendency towards high ROI rates. If china gives that it has to follow it. Brand is a name based on believes generated deliberately by communication program off course supported by quality of a good.
China unfortunately does not tend to deliver good image and always reminds doggy stuff. However that doesn't justify every china made is like that. Sony is made in china, Not only that %90 percent of everything is made in china. But some of it is rubbish because market requires as such. Brand asks for lesser quality in raw material to reduce the cost so that they avoid to let go their employees. As conscious customers, we have to demand good merc with better customer service behind. Location shouldn't matter.

Toengel
06-20-2011, 12:54 PM
- We continue to produce in Europe,
- We continue to design in Europe,
- We remain a European brand (with HQ in Amsterdam, the Netherlands).

Hi,

that's good to hear - maybe I should apply for a job in the consumer electronics branch ;)

Toengel@Alex

tolgaakcan
06-20-2011, 01:02 PM
Hi, Tonegel, with that 1166 post..

If there is a job deserves a caring expert on TV that'd be you.. :)