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meme80
10-20-2011, 07:57 AM
Hi,

I've recently bought the Philips TV 47PFL7606M/08 and I'm using the capability to record and pause TV (Smart USB recording).

To test this functionality I've attached my only external 2.5" USB 2.0 HDD of 250GB.

The manual is reporting that:

"To pause or record a digital broadcast, you need to connect a USB hard disk. Use a USB 2.0 compatible hard disk with a minimum of 250 GB hard disk space. Ensure that the USB hard disk supports a minimum transfer speed of 30MBps".

and also "To pause broadcasts, you need a USB hard disk with a minimum size of 32 GB hard disk space".

My questions are:

1- Can I use an USB 2.0 pendrive of 32GB to pause a digital broadcast? It is more flexible then an external USB drive (smaller, no need of cables, less power consuming, etc...)?
Which are the minimum requirement of read/write speed for an USB 2.0 pendrive to use the pause feature?

2- Why do I need an external HDD of MINIMUM 250GB to record a TV program? Once a TV program is recorded I just saw it once and then problably it is not needed any more (it is not possible to extract the program and save it on DVD or PC so why keep it on the hdd?). This limit of 250GB do not allow me to use a usb pendrive because it simply does not exist today a pendrive of 250GB.

I hope to get an answer to my questions.

Thanking you in advance,

Emanuele

Philips - Thomas
10-20-2011, 08:04 AM
Hi

can you use an USB Stick instead of a HDD > you can try BUT! it is known that for the most USB Sticks, the writing Speed is too slow. That why we do recommend HDD's.
Can i use a 32GB USB Stick > no, you need min. 32GB available Space on the Stick/HDD. A 32GB USB Stick does not have the Full 32GB capacity.

Regards
Thomas

meme80
10-20-2011, 08:21 AM
Ok, it is therefore mandatory to have an HDD with 250GB to record a TV program and an HDD with minimum 32GB of effective free space to pause a digital broadcast.

Thank you for your quick and very exaustive reply.

Best Regards,

Philips - Thomas
10-20-2011, 09:04 AM
Hi

No it is not mandatory.
But! you connect a drive for PVR, this one will be formated and from this very moment, this Drive is THE Drive for the TV.
If you change the Drive, the old one with all of its content is obsolete. At the Moment, a new Drive is connected and formated, the old one will not be recognized with the content anymore.
250GBs is in fact a very low amount of Space if you keep in mind that if you make scheduled Recordings for TV Series, the Drive will get full very fast and at this Point you have to delete content to be able to record again.

Regards
Thomas

meme80
10-20-2011, 09:47 AM
Hi,

when I wrote "it is therefore mandatory to have an HDD" I meant that:

for pause a digital broadcast an usb pendrive cannot be used for the typical low speed capability of a pendrive. Also, it is cheaper buy a 500 GB HDD then a 64GB pendrive.

for recording a digital broadcast an usb pendrive cannot be used because the TV will not accept a device with less then 250GB of space. Today, as far as I know, there are not pendrive with 250GB of space.

stated that above, only HDD can be used. Is this correct?


Another question, how much space is used for two hours recording?

I mean if I have a 250GB free space drive how many hours of scheduled recording I can do before I need to delete recordings to free up space?

Thanks,

Philips - Thomas
10-20-2011, 10:00 AM
for pause a digital broadcast an usb pendrive cannot be used for the typical low speed capability of a pendrive. Also, it is cheaper buy a 500 GB HDD then a 64GB pendrive.


No, thats not what i wrote. You can use a USB Stick, but you need to be aware that most of the Sticks on the Market are simply to slow and yes, Sticks with the capacity, needed for recording, are not what you will call "cheap".



for recording a digital broadcast an usb pendrive cannot be used because the TV will not accept a device with less then 250GB of space. Today, as far as I know, there are not pendrive with 250GB of space.


Like i wrote, there are Sticks available and if the Write Speed is fast enough, it will work.



stated that above, only HDD can be used. Is this correct?


no



Another question, how much space is used for two hours recording?

I mean if I have a 250GB free space drive how many hours of scheduled recording I can do before I need to delete recordings to free up space?

Thanks,

This depends on the content , delivered from the Provider, so there is no General Statement.

Regards
Thomas

meme80
10-20-2011, 11:40 AM
No, thats not what i wrote. You can use a USB Stick, but you need to be aware that most of the Sticks on the Market are simply to slow and yes, Sticks with the capacity, needed for recording, are not what you will call "cheap".

Ok but is there a clear and specific technical requirement? I cannot buy a usb stick just looking for a "fast one" I need a technical requirement like: write minimum speed 4Mb/s or Class 4.




Like i wrote, there are Sticks available and if the Write Speed is fast enough, it will work.


As far as I know there are no usb stick with a minimum of 250 GB. That's why the HDD becomes a must to have at least the PVR cabability. Or are you telling me that I can record broadcast on a 64GB usb stick?



This depends on the content , delivered from the Provider, so there is no General Statement.


Is there a way to know how much space is free after a broadcast has been recorded?
Is there a way to know how much space is currently using a recorded broadcast?
In this way I can record a Standard Definition broadcast and figure out how many hours I can storage on the 250GB HDD.

Emanuele,
Best Regards

a_Tom
10-20-2011, 01:47 PM
Kingston Data Traveler 310

regarding the write speed you should have at least 30MB/s
you can see the % of free space in the IPEPG overview

meme80
10-20-2011, 03:19 PM
Kingston Data Traveler 310

regarding the write speed you should have at least 30MB/s

Unfortunately that USB pendrive costs about 800€ and with the same price a buy another TV...


you can see the % of free space in the IPEPG overview

Thank you.

a_Tom
10-20-2011, 03:24 PM
sure it is expensive... but that was not the question, the question was, will it work, so answer is yes.
btw you also get 120GB USB3.0 Stick this Days for ~200€, will not take long till this will also extend to +2xx GB....

meme80
10-20-2011, 04:19 PM
sure it is expensive... but that was not the question, the question was, will it work, so answer is yes.

The answer is probably no, it will not work.

I've just checked the write speed (http://www.kingston.com/flash/dt_chart.asp) and it is only 12MB/s when Philips request minimum of 30MB/s write speed.


btw you also get 120GB USB3.0 Stick this Days for ~200€, will not take long till this will also extend to +2xx GB....

Not possible to record with that (you need 250GB to record) only to pause a digital broadcast. If I need only to pause then 64 Mb stick is cheper but, unfortunatly, not fast enough.

Right now it seems that an HDD (250GB) is required because there are no other alternatives.

Toengel
10-20-2011, 05:06 PM
Hi,

you can buy a good USB powered HDD with 500GB for less than 70 EUR....

Toengel@Alex

meme80
10-21-2011, 06:46 AM
Hi,

you can buy a good USB powered HDD with 500GB for less than 70 EUR....

Toengel@Alex

I know I can use a HDD for this, I have already an HDD attached to the TV.
I was wondering if I could replace the HDD with a usb stick and today there is not this possibility due to the following reason:

- USB sticks are too slow (12 Mb/s write speed is not enought)
- USB sticks capacity required by Philips sw are really too expensive (64GB minimum for pause and 250GB for recording) when compared to HDD.

Other TV (e.g. Sharp) can use USB sticks of minimum 1GB for time shift (digital pause). I cannot understand why Philips requires 64GB with a write speed that is not achivable today...

Polderboy
11-10-2011, 03:04 PM
Can someone give me a modelnuber of a external harddisk with usb powering that will work on a Philips TV?
I have a 46PFL8606H.
I bought a Iomega Prestige USB 3.0 today ( 500gb) but after the TV has formatted the disk, I see contantly "writingerror" on my screen.
I called Philips today and they say they dont have a list of harddisk that will work. They think it uses to much power.

The Iomega Prestige is connected with a USB-Y cable, but whatever I do, use the one or two uSB sockets, it stil gives the writing error.

No I hear good experiences with a external hardisk, so please let me know what is a good buy.

jjs
11-12-2011, 01:30 PM
the tv can only give 500mA with a boost to 600mA on the USB.
But you can use a Powered USB HUB as some models only have one USB port.
And if you have a wifi dongle then need a HUB if you have a model with just one usb port.

Perpetual Beta
12-09-2011, 09:40 PM
The answer is probably no, it will not work.

I've just checked the write speed (http://www.kingston.com/flash/dt_chart.asp) and it is only 12MB/s when Philips request minimum of 30MB/s write speed.
...


My guess: 30 MB/s should read 30 Mb/s (Megabit per second) here. Hi-Speed (USB 2.0) data rate is 480 Mbit/second brutto. Typical sustainable write speeds for external hard drives with USB 2.0 interface (Hi-Speed) are 20 .. 28 MByte/second. USB Devices with sustainable write speed above 25 MByte/s are implemented with USB 3.0 (SuperSpeed). Or limited to specific hardware.


30 MByte/second ought to be more than enough for time-shifting of a complete satellite transponder's data streams. If implemented state-of-the-art, half of the time assumed for reading.

jjs
12-11-2011, 09:09 AM
- USB sticks capacity required by Philips sw are really too expensive (64GB minimum for pause and 250GB for recording) when compared to HDD.



That is not correct.
32Gbyte is the minimum requirement and they say 30Mb/s, but i don't know if that writing speed is available yet, It has to be usb 2.0 compatible at least.

Toengel
12-11-2011, 09:19 AM
Hi,

32 GB does not mean that 32 GB are really available - thats the reason, why 64 GB was posted... ;-)

I suggest to try a portalbe USB HDD...

Toengel@Alex

jjs
12-11-2011, 09:36 AM
Hi Toengel,
no prob.
I don't know what is available exactly. ;)

Toengel
12-11-2011, 09:46 AM
Hi,

what I want to say is that if you buy a 32 GB stick you won't have 32 GB memory available - it's less than 32 GB!

Teongel@Alex

jjs
12-11-2011, 10:53 AM
Yes you are right.
If the set is looking that strict to available memory then it could be that you need a 64MB.
I did not test it.

H.K
01-05-2012, 06:30 PM
Following your statement that recording with fast USB stick is possible I bought a 64 GB USB 3.0 stick and started the formating process at my 37pfl9606k_02. This process was stopped short before reaching the end status. Repeating this brings no change. In contradiction to your statement recording with fast USB stick is evidently NOT POSSIBLE.
If I'm wrong please let me know how to solve this problem.

meme80
01-07-2012, 04:34 PM
Could you please specify the model of your usb stick?
For now we know it is a 64GB USB 3.0 but it is necessary to know write/read speed and model.
Thanks,

jjs
01-07-2012, 05:27 PM
We had a problem with a usb 3.0 250Gbyte from a customer, wich would format, but then would not be writeable. Until now there is no solution for it. Unfortunately i can't remember the brand from the hdd.

And yes you can only use one HDD.