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Peter Walker
11-11-2011, 03:09 AM
Hi,
I am in the process of deciding on and buying a new 3D-TV. As a British Ex-Pat, living in Cologne, Germany, my needs are somewhat unusual as I watch German TV via Cable and UK TV via Sat.


First some general info:

1. Current TVs are an old JVC CRT TV, which is due to be scrapped, and a Samsung SyncMaster XL2370HD (Computer monitor with TV function)

2. My usage is as follows: 15% Wii Console, 10% DVDs (Blu Ray), 25% German-TV via cable, 40% UK-TV (mainly BBC) via ASTRA 2, 10% BBC iPlayer over the Internet (with VPN).

3. Distance from seat to TV: 3-4 metres

4. Desired TV-size: 42-47"

5. Budget: About 800 Euro

6. 3D-TV: Would like to use 3D-TV from the following souces: Blu-Ray, Sky-3D Channel and my Fujifilm REAL 3D-W3 camera (takes .mpo 3D images and 3D HD Movies.

7. Environment: TV is to be used in my living room next to a large window.

8. Technology: I am interested in a passive 3D-TV as the active type causes headaches. I am therefore considering TVs from LG, Philips and Toshiba where Philips is the most likely to be purchased as LG does not support Sat USB recording and Toshiba does not have USB recording at all on their passive sets. DVB-S2 and DVB-C Tuner are important.

My Questions:
UK-TV uses a different EPG-Technology to that used in Germany. I have found that most standard Sat-Recievers will only show the Now and Next programs with UK-TV channels. Can the Philips TV properly interpret the EPG used on UK broadcasts (BBC One, etc.)?

I notice that your TVs obtain TV-Listings over the internet. Does this mean that the EPG issues are not relevant as long as I have the TV connected to the Internet? Please explain if this system will work with both BBC and German channels.

I originally planned to get an LG 42" TV-Set, but I was put off by the fact that their DVR USB Recording feature does not work with Sat-programs. Do the Philips TVs fully support Sat-TV recording? I have a little standalone Sat receiver (Avanit SHD5) and that allows Sat USB recording to *.ts files readable on a PC). That device cost me 70 Euro so why do TVs with uSB recording make it impossible to use the USB recordings on a PC as well?

The members of the LG support forum are angry about the lack of Sat. support on their TVs and LG does not appear to be interested in fixing this feature. When I came here to research the 42PFL7606K, I was pleasantly surprised to find Philips engineers actually taking notice of customer wishes and adding features that were asked for. That is a major point in favour of Philips.

As I also have an AVCHD Camcorder, can I place the SDHC card from that in the card reader and play the recordings (*.mts)?

What is important for me is the ability to use the BBC iPlayer as an App in SmartTV. Reading through the forums, it appears that such an App is available. I use a VPN service to give me a UK IP. Is it possible to set a proxy in the Internet settings as that is all I need to be able to play the iPlayer (I currently do this with my Wii).

After some research, the Philips 42PFL7606K is now top of my list, although I am concerned about the bugs reported on Amazon by several users. However, bugs reported on this forum do seem to get acted upon, so it looks like the bugs reported on Amazon are likely to get fixed.

That leaves the possible problem of clouding on the Philips TV which several people have reported here. Are there ways of preventing this and does it affect everybody or only those from a bad batch?

I look forward to your responses and hope to buy a Philips 3D-TV in a few days.

Regards

Peter

AnSta
11-15-2011, 06:09 AM
I'm not an intense user like you are. I'm only using the 42PFL7606K to watch tv via cable so I can only answer a few of your questions.

You can choose between dhcp and manual ip configuration. I did not see an option to enter a proxy there, just the normal primary and secondary dns, gateway, netmask settings.

The comments on Amazon are both, right and wrong. For example, some users reported that the sound does come from the right side. That's because the 42"+ models speaker does not sit in the middle. The thing is, it is true but the question is, would I have noticed it without knowing about it? It feels like I can hear where the sound is coming from because _I know_ it's coming from the right side. ;)

When it comes to backlight bleeding then I'm one of the unlucky guys. Depending on which Smart Picture setting I pick it backlight bleeding is either almost non-existant to horrible. Unfortunately for me it's horrible in the best preset (Cinema) while others report it's the best mode for them.
What disappoints me is that support was unable to help me without me taking a picture of the problem. I didn't know that you need to have a digital cam to get support for your TV?! Maybe they should bundle one if it's mandatory (lol...).

Would I buy the same TV again? Probably not. Would I buy Philips again? Probably yes. The sad truth is, every manufacturer has their own annoying problems and we are kind of hardware beta testers. It took me weeks to decide till I realised that. The only thing I would really really do different is take 300€ more and get the model with Ambilight 3.

Peter Walker
11-15-2011, 08:29 AM
Thanks for your reply. After much deliberation, I have now ordered the Philips 42PFL7606K and expect it to be delivered later this week. I hope there will be no bleeding or clouding issues with the TV.

If the TV does not support the manual entry of a proxy (normally standard on such devices, my Wii has it), I will have to setup a proxy through the router. I will report here when I have it setup.

I will set the TV to have its local country to be UK so that the BBC iPlayer will work.

I will report back more once I have received and setup my TV.

Regards

Peter

Peter Walker
11-20-2011, 02:42 PM
I have now received my new TV. I actually got the 42PFL7666K/02 which is basically the same as the 7606, yet with better speakers and built-in WiFi.

I originally tried to set UK as the home country (as my Sat reception is via Astra 2), but unfortunately, German Digital Cable-TV was not recognised. Analogue Cable worked, but not digital. I then reinstalled the TV giving Germany as my home country and then German cable TV worked.

Let me answer some of my own questions here, as this might help others:

1. I am glad to say that the internet based EPG does give me full EPG data for UK-Based programs (BBC, etc), whereas the broadcast based UK-EPG only gives me the now and next programs as expected. The online EPG is therefore a good thing in this respect.

2. The Philips TV will handle USB recording from both cable and sat signals. However, the USB recording feature is not exactly comfortable.

3. I tried a SD Card from my AVCHD Camcorder. Although the TV has its own SD-Card reader, SD-Cards are not recognized in it so I had to use a USB card reader instead. The TV was unable to playback the recordings on that card. Given the popularity of this format on modern Camcorders, I hope Philips, will add support for the .mts format in a future firmware upgrade.

4. As the TV does not have any ability to define a web proxy (unlike my Wii console for example), I have been unable to determine if the BBC iPlayer will work yet. However, the Wii BBC iPlayer does work very well with the Philips TV.

5. I have been finding a number of bugs and stability problems. I will document and report them in the appropriate places (not sure if the Philips engineers would bother to read this post without a better defined subject line). The most buggy part is the "Programme Guide" with a number of problems.

6. Luckily, I have not noticed any clouding issues so far, but I have not really tested this properly yet, either.

Just in case someone is reading this from Philips technical support, I would like to report a major problem, with the Philips support website.

When I look for my TV on the Philips support website, it is not recognised:
http://www.support.philips.com/support/sms_page.jsp?userLanguage=en&userCountry=de

When I search for my model number (with country settings Germany/English), I get this error:

"Sorry, no results for '42PFL7666K/02', please try again or search by the categories below."

The 42PFL7606K/02 is recognised, but this is a different model where at least the WLAN feature is missing. I was able to download the firmware for my TV by manually correcting the download link to:
http://www.p4c.philips.com/cgi-bin/dcbint/eula.pl?slg=AEN&ctn=42PFL7666K/02&dct=FUS&link=/files/4/42pfl7666k_02/42pfl7606k_02_fus_aen.zip&new_tmpl=1&mode=inpage

Not exactly customer friendly, please correct this. I downloaded both firmware files (for 7606 and 7666) and performed a binary compare of the files. They were identical so it looks like it is fine to download the 7606K/02 firmware as well.

I am still testing the TV so will give more detailed info on the bugs I found on this forum. I understand that complicated products like this may still have bugs at first. Anyone using Microsoft products know that. It is the speed with which reported bugs are fixed that defines a good company.

Regards

Peter

David A Russell
12-19-2011, 04:48 PM
[QUOTE=Peter Walker;17266]I have now received my new TV. I actually got the 42PFL7666K/02 which is basically the same as the 7606, yet with better speakers and built-in WiFi.

I originally tried to set UK as the home country (as my Sat reception is via Astra 2), but unfortunately, German Digital Cable-TV was not recognised. Analogue Cable worked, but not digital. I then reinstalled the TV giving Germany as my home country and then German cable TV worked.

Let me answer some of my own questions here, as this might help others:

1. I am glad to say that the internet based EPG does give me full EPG data for UK-Based programs (BBC, etc), whereas the broadcast based UK-EPG only gives me the now and next programs as expected. The online EPG is therefore a good thing in this respect.


Hi Peter, I too am in Germany and use Sat and Cable and actually UK TV , German TV and Chinese with the 50 PFL 7956. I only see German programs in the EPG, none of my UK programs. It lists those that I watch and those I do not, i.e.e not from my Favourites. How did you get the EPG to show UK programs from teh Sat? e..g. BBC1, ITV 1 etc..? I want to record programs from there and cannot get it to show. I did try editing a program in the EPG list searching for BBC and overwrriting it, but havent tried recording from there yet. TV was broken, did not populate EPG at all, nore record reliably so after 6 weeks got a new one from Philps and just received and re isntalled.

Appreciate any ideas or advise.

Thanks

David

Peter Walker
12-19-2011, 06:42 PM
Hi David,
I did not have to do anything special for the EPG. If you select "Watch TV", the EPG shows the German (Cable) channels. After you select "Watch Sat", the EPG then shows the Sat programs. You have to make sure the channels are recognized as well. There appears to be a bug in the EPG where some channels are not recognized properly. e.g. ITV1+1 is not recognized and the system looks for TV1+1 instead. This can be fixed manually.

Sorting the channels is the most laborious job, and I hope the PC based program for sorting the channels is released soon.

By the way, with a trick it is possible to get the BBC iPlayer to work as well.

David A Russell
12-20-2011, 09:46 AM
Thanks for the quick reply. I have watch sat, but only see lots of channels, mostly German starting with ARD etc.. but see none of the english ones in the EPG. It lists many I do not watch, and which are not in my favourites, but only 3 pages or so total channels listed in EPG. Not the 3500 channels I see before selecting the 30 or so into favourites, but seems random mostly German channels none of teh english ones. I am not sure whet it is I am njot doing. I am for example watching sat TV and then go to home screen and select EPG. Is there any other setting I am missing? I tried channel search for BBC 1for example and overrode the ARD listing in the epg, it did show all BBC1 programs but when I tried to record it records the ARD program not teh one I overrode it with BBC1. Thanks

Peter Walker
12-20-2011, 10:01 AM
Sounds to me like you have not yet sorted the channels. You can do this via the find button.

I did this by first going through all the channels and marking the ones I like as favorites. Then I changed the list to show just the favorites and then used Options/Reorder to sort the programs in the order I wanted. It is important to change the number associated with the channel. I ended up with a list like this:

1 BBC One-HD
2 BBC Two
3 BBC Three
4 BBC Four
5 BBC HD
6 ITV1 HD
7 ITV2
8 ITV3
9 ITV4
10 Channel 4 HD
etc.

Once you have sorted the channels like this, they appear in the same order in the EPG.

I hope this helps.

Peter

David A Russell
12-20-2011, 09:59 PM
Thanks, I did select the favorites but did not sort them Is there a Limit to max number of programs in the EPG? Mine only seems to show a limited number and is this why if not sorted it cannot show those further down teh list? Why though would it show many programs not in my favourites and also many double of the German ones like RTL2 etc.. show twice one below the other... In the help page it says select update program guide but there is no menu to do that. I am lost on how to show just the programs I want in the EPG and not all teh ones I do not want and many of which are not in my favorites.


Any ideas?

Sounds to me like you have not yet sorted the channels. You can do this via the find button.

I did this by first going through all the channels and marking the ones I like as favorites. Then I changed the list to show just the favorites and then used Options/Reorder to sort the programs in the order I wanted. It is important to change the number associated with the channel. I ended up with a list like this:

1 BBC One-HD
2 BBC Two
3 BBC Three
4 BBC Four
5 BBC HD
6 ITV1 HD
7 ITV2
8 ITV3
9 ITV4
10 Channel 4 HD
etc.

Once you have sorted the channels like this, they appear in the same order in the EPG.

I hope this helps.

Peter

theo2
12-21-2011, 08:24 AM
Hi Peter and other (lucky) owners of PFL7606 ! I have question about gaming on this TV as some people complaints to "brotherīs" LG LW650(570) high input lag even if in game mode. Can you please measure this lag or at least write your feeling with playing games on this TV ? Thanks

Peter Walker
12-21-2011, 09:11 AM
Thanks, I did select the favorites but did not sort them Is there a Limit to max number of programs in the EPG? Mine only seems to show a limited number and is this why if not sorted it cannot show those further down teh list? Why though would it show many programs not in my favourites and also many double of the German ones like RTL2 etc.. show twice one below the other... In the help page it says select update program guide but there is no menu to do that. I am lost on how to show just the programs I want in the EPG and not all teh ones I do not want and many of which are not in my favorites.

Any ideas?

David,
On my TV, I can see about 100 channels in the EPG so that may be the limit. As far as I can see, the deciding factor is the number associated with the channel. Sort the programs as you want them with new numbers and all should be well. This can be changed manually and that is what I did.

To reorder the channels, I first made a list of which number I wanted to associate with each channel and then used the reorder function to move them. Use the "Find" button to list the channels, press "Options/Reorder" and find the channel you want to move. For example, say "BBC One HD" is found at channel 427, with the reorder function active, press OK on that channel. Now enter the new channel number, in this case "1", and press OK. The channel has now been moved. Repeat this for all the channels that interest you.

I hope this helps.

I will not have much time in the next few days, lots of things to do for Christmas, so I hope this helps.

Regards

Peter

MrEdd
12-21-2011, 09:12 AM
Hi Peter and other (lucky) owners of PFL7606 ! I have question about gaming on this TV as some people complaints to "brotherīs" LG LW650(570) high input lag even if in game mode. Can you please measure this lag or at least write your feeling with playing games on this TV ? Thanks

Hi I have a 42PFL7666t/12 at the moment but had a 42PFL7606 very recently and I game using a PS3 via a HDMI connection.

Gaming would be great BUT if I game in 3D mode the ambilights flash intermittently like a very bright camera flash!! its very annoying and quite shocking. This fault occurs even if you turn the ambilight feature off.

I have been trying to get Philips to help me with this issue on this forum (as well as trying all I can myself - including a TV swap) but have not been happy with their response. In fact Philips have not responded at all on this forum !!!!.

You can read all about it in my thread ......

Flashing ambilight issue while 3D gaming on my PS3

P.S its not just me who are affected by this - many others are struggling with this too.

Kind regards.

Peter Walker
12-21-2011, 09:43 AM
I use a Wii for gaming which is connected via the component input. I have not noticed any issues with the TV in this mode. The only thing I do notice is that the TV does not smooth out the edges like it does on digital TV. In other words, standard definition TV from the internal tuner, etc. seems to be processed to make the video look almost as good as HD source video. This does not happen on the component and scart inputs.

Sorry I cannot help more, unless someone wants to give me a PS3 for Christmas :-)

Regards

Peter

Toengel
12-21-2011, 09:47 AM
Hi,

I think you can setup the enhancement feature for each kind of input - also for component input...

ToengelqAlex

MrEdd
12-21-2011, 10:06 AM
I use a Wii for gaming which is connected via the component input. I have not noticed any issues with the TV in this mode. The only thing I do notice is that the TV does not smooth out the edges like it does on digital TV. In other words, standard definition TV from the internal tuner, etc. seems to be processed to make the video look almost as good as HD source video. This does not happen on the component and scart inputs.

Sorry I cannot help more, unless someone wants to give me a PS3 for Christmas :-)

Regards

Peter

Hi peter.

I too have 2 Wii consoles both hooked up through component cables. first Wii is hooked up to the living room Philips Ambilight TV (42pfl7962 - an older model) and the second one one is hooked up to the 42pfl7666t/12 (the new one I'm having issues with). I know what you mean about the edges not smoothed out on the new 7000 series. my 42pfl7962 does a much better job with the Wii.

As toengel says though you can improve the image with the settings. I found the Photo setting a good starting point but if you find a better one let me know.

Kind regards.

Peter Walker
12-21-2011, 10:27 AM
I currently have it set to Game and there are lots of jagged edges to be seen. It would be great if they could be smoothed out, but not essential - the games can still be played. I had a quick look at the photo mode, but did not notice an improvement.

So I am open for any advice on how to improve the picture on my component input for my Wii.

Regards

Peter

MrEdd
12-21-2011, 05:55 PM
I will have a play and see if I can improve my Wii's image through component input. If I can I will let you know in this thread.

Regards.

theo2
12-22-2011, 04:18 PM
I have question about SD pisture quality in this TV, exactly in 47"model. Today I visited one shop to try picture quality. I took USB flash memory with SD content - first was ts file recorded from DVB-T and second one downloaded Jurastic Park in avi file with subtitles. In my present CRT TV are both in very good picture quality, even in 70" projection is able to see from 3,5m. I was very surprised by bad imaging in PFL7606 ( moreover 42"), it looks like low-end telenovela with lot of artefacts. I see this TV from cca 2 - 3 m, but still I saw bad image :-( Is possible this degradation of image is becuse of "true motion" or similar "improvements" ? Also subtitles dont func function at all :-(

Peter Walker
01-05-2012, 10:26 PM
Over Christmas, I connected my Wii to a Samsung Full-HD TV using the same component cable. On that TV, the edges were nice and smooth like you would expect. With the Philips, I still get these jagged edges which are quite noticable. As Samsung are able to solve this problem, surely this should be easy for Philips to fix. On other inputs, the Philips has a superb picture, but really disappoints with the Wii component picture. I will dig out the original FBAS cable and see if that looks any better.

Regards

Peter

MrEdd
01-12-2012, 10:17 AM
Over Christmas, I connected my Wii to a Samsung Full-HD TV using the same component cable. On that TV, the edges were nice and smooth like you would expect. With the Philips, I still get these jagged edges which are quite noticable. As Samsung are able to solve this problem, surely this should be easy for Philips to fix. On other inputs, the Philips has a superb picture, but really disappoints with the Wii component picture. I will dig out the original FBAS cable and see if that looks any better.

Regards

Peter

Hi all,

Over the last few days I have been trying to improve the picture on my Wii using a good quality component cable but I am not able to smooth the edges out either.

My older 42" Philips Ambilight TV does a much better job with the Wii!!.

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated by all of us trying to get the best out of our Philips TV / Wii.

Kind regards.

GPDawes
02-06-2012, 10:50 PM
I use to use my WII with a Pioneer dedicated upscaler I just sold cheaply on ebay.
Sounds like I should have kept it.

Just returned my 7606 and was hoping to get a 7666 but may change my mind.
LG W550 looking tempting.

Reading all these forums things seem to be getting worse not better, Other sets have better EPG's , better scaling of SD , and display album art when playing files from a NAS server.

Some serious thinking to do before parting with $$$

Peter Walker
02-06-2012, 11:41 PM
Hi,
I looked into the Wii issue more closely and objectively. First of all, the comparison is not with screens of the same size. The Philips TV used is the 42PFL7666K/02 and the Samsung one used is the SyncMaster XL2370HD which is actually my Full-HD computer monitor with built-in TV-Tuner.

This image is made using the Wii Fit plus Free Cycling game.

http://www.startrekphase2.de/files/WiiCompare.jpg
Philips on top, Samsung on bottom

As you can see, the Philips screen has slightly more jagged edges on the head compared to the Samsung. It is these jagged edges that give you the impression the picture is not as good. However, when looking closely, the differences are actually much smaller than the subjective impression. The Philips TV has a much better image than the Samsung when viewing digital TV or Blu Ray disks, it is just the Wii which appears better (although smaller on the 23" screen) on the Samsung.

By now, I am now used to the more jagged edges, but it would be great if Philips could somehow tweak the image just a little bit more.

Regards

Peter

Frank1977
02-07-2012, 06:00 AM
Hello,

regarding TV USB recording: Sadly, many of today's TVs encrypt the recorded MPEG stream so it is only readable on the device it was recorded with. You cannot cut ads out, you cannot recompress it, you cannot play it anywhere else, so if your TV breaks (apparently, even if they only have to replace the mainboard inside it) your media collection is gone.

I was told by a hotline member that this is due to an agreement with the TV studios: they don't want people to create TV movie collections this way. You are supposed to buy the DVDs.

For this reason (among some others) I brought my Philips TV back and purchased a TV without USB recording, plus a separate receiver with uncrippled USB recording. This has the added advantage that you can record one show and watch another at the same time.

Regards

matthias
02-07-2012, 08:30 AM
Over Christmas, I connected my Wii to a Samsung Full-HD TV using the same component cable. On that TV, the edges were nice and smooth like you would expect. With the Philips, I still get these jagged edges which are quite noticable.

I noticed, that the Smart Picture preset is set and remembered for each individual input.
So, you could try the following:

Select the Wii Input, and try to change the picture settings in the Settings Menu and change the "Sharpness" setting and see if the edges disappear.

If you disable sharping, these edges disappear. Just be aware you cannot just "sharpen" a picture, you can only make it _appear sharper by increasing the edge contrast.
But this only works if the edges are small enough (i.e. the distance to the picture is large enough).

So if you have a large TV in a small room, you probably should reduce or disable the Sharping.