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youplaboom
07-10-2012, 05:01 PM
Hi,

I've got a 40PFL8606 TV

I can play a 1.3 GiB .avi file (see description below) using a USB stick connected directly to the TV.
I'm unable to play the same file through DLNA. I can get smaller video files working (<~1 GiB). I can listen to music (mp3).

I tried xbmc and serviio as DNLA server but there's no way to get this file working through my network. Of course downscaling (if available ) has been disabled.
This file is just a example and I'm having the same problem with other >1GiB files.

TV is up to date with the last firmware and the connection is ethernet with a gigabit switch (no wifi).

Any idea ?

Thanks


Format : AVI
Format/Info : Audio Video Interleave
Format profile : OpenDML
File size : 1.31 GiB
Overall bit rate : 1 456 Kbps
Format : MPEG-4 Visual
Codec ID : XVID
Codec ID/Hint : XviD
Duration : 2h X mn
Bit rate : 1 131 Kbps
Width : 640 pixels
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Codec ID : 2000
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 320 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels

klauzser
07-16-2012, 02:54 AM
Same with me. I also tried it with external hard disk and it also works, but still not with DNLA server. What seems to be the problem? http://imagicon.info/cat/12-19/vbsmile.png

Philips - Benedickte
07-18-2012, 01:08 PM
Hi,

I've got a 40PFL8606 TV

I can play a 1.3 GiB .avi file (see description below) using a USB stick connected directly to the TV.
I'm unable to play the same file through DLNA. I can get smaller video files working (<~1 GiB). I can listen to music (mp3).

I tried xbmc and serviio as DNLA server but there's no way to get this file working through my network. Of course downscaling (if available ) has been disabled.
This file is just a example and I'm having the same problem with other >1GiB files.

TV is up to date with the last firmware and the connection is ethernet with a gigabit switch (no wifi).

Any idea ?

Thanks


Format : AVI
Format/Info : Audio Video Interleave
Format profile : OpenDML
File size : 1.31 GiB
Overall bit rate : 1 456 Kbps
Format : MPEG-4 Visual
Codec ID : XVID
Codec ID/Hint : XviD
Duration : 2h X mn
Bit rate : 1 131 Kbps
Width : 640 pixels
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Codec ID : 2000
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 320 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels


Hi Youplaboom

I would advice you to update to latest software that came out yesterday. you will find this on the support page for you TV.

What is the exact Message you get when the files isn't playing?
Have you tried to play this file from Windows media Player 11, if you are using windows, or Twonky Media if you're using mac.

As I can see you are saying this file is working over USB and smaller files works over DLNA, your TV is fine.
This seems to be an issue with network limitations. It can be the cable you are using not supporting a lagers amount of transfer or you are using to much of the network connected to other devices so it;'s not enough for playing this file.


Best regards
Benedickte

youplaboom
07-27-2012, 03:18 PM
Hi Youplaboom
I would advice you to update to latest software that came out yesterday. you will find this on the support page for you TV.


I'll test that



What is the exact Message you get when the files isn't playing?
Have you tried to play this file from Windows media Player 11, if you are using windows, or Twonky Media if you're using mac.


I don't remember it anymore. I'll take a picture the next time I get it
No, I did not use Windows media Player 11, I made my tests with xbmc and serviio (as my post sais), my aim is to use a NAS as DLNA server . But I'll test it for you with that ( Windows media Player 11 ) software.





As I can see you are saying this file is working over USB and smaller files works over DLNA, your TV is fine.
This seems to be an issue with network limitations. It can be the cable you are using not supporting a lagers amount of transfer or you are using to much of the network connected to other devices so it;'s not enough for playing this file.



Cable is Cat 6 so it's gigabit ready
The switch is a gigabit switch (as I already said)
My router refers 5 connected device on the newtork. 2 PC, 1 TV, 1 access point, 1 cell phone. So no bottleneck

But I know one bottleneck in my network, it's the router, which is a 100mb router. I'll change it to check if it improves the network. But there's no reason to route data through it on the same subnet. If the TV does, perhaps its network implementation is incorrect and then it's up to you to fix it.

youplaboom
08-02-2012, 06:00 PM
Hi again,

The bold parts are the themes on which I except an answer from you.

Good news, after the firmware update, streaming of those files is now possible over the network.
Bad news, it takes between 50 seconds and 3 minutes to load the files.
Subtitles work with the USB stick, but no way to get them working with a dlna server.
I got a successful stream with

xbmc
serviio (transcoding disabled)
all share, guess what, that's the embedded app from samsung on my galaxy SII mobile phone. That little thing streams with no transcoding through my 54mb wifi to my philips TV, flawlessly.




Hi Youplaboom
I would advice you to update to latest software that came out yesterday. you will find this on the support page for you TV.


Done finally, so it's Q5551-0.14.99.0



What is the exact Message you get when the files isn't playing?
Have you tried to play this file from Windows media Player 11, if you are using windows, or Twonky Media if you're using mac.


There's no message when the file is not playing. Just a black screen
I have tried with windows media player, the codec ( MPEG-4 Visual) is not recognized so there is no way to test it further.



As I can see you are saying this file is working over USB and smaller files works over DLNA, your TV is fine.
This seems to be an issue with network limitations. It can be the cable you are using not supporting a lagers amount of transfer or you are using to much of the network connected to other devices so it;'s not enough for playing this file.


About network limitation, what is the bandwidth the TV needs. I think the network is not an issue, as once the stream has started the task manager says it uses 1% of the 100mb available. That matches with the "Overall bit rate : 1 456 Kbps" given in the .nfo file, even if the windows task manager should indicate 1.5% of network use.

Thanks for your support

Philips - Thomas
08-03-2012, 09:29 AM
Hey

Black screen and no error means, that the TV is waiting for the Server to start, so its lets call it "prebuffering". But thats a Matter of the Server as the TV is only showning whats been delivered by the Server.
About SUbtitles, indeed we don't support that via DLNA because our TV's cant handle 2 Streams the same Time, a Subtitle is a Second Stream.
Only way to get this Solved is to hardcode the Subtitle to the Video.

Thomas

youplaboom
08-03-2012, 10:21 AM
Hey
Black screen and no error means, that the TV is waiting for the Server to start, so its lets call it "prebuffering". But thats a Matter of the Server as the TV is only showning whats been delivered by the Server.

3 Different servers on two different devices having the same slow "prebuffering". I do not agree, the problem is on the TV. You tried to blame every component on the network except the TV. It was the network cable, the bandwidth, the number of devices or whatever...
There's no prebuffering necessary for a < 1GiB file, why should there be one for a bigger one. There must be a mis-implementation in your firmware.



About SUbtitles, indeed we don't support that via DLNA because our TV's cant handle 2 Streams the same Time, a Subtitle is a Second Stream.
Only way to get this Solved is to hardcode the Subtitle to the Video.

Are you kidding or what, wake up all your competitor do support subtitle and You even do support it with USB. I checked xbmc and serviio documentation and they support subtitles.
I found here that (http://doc.ubuntu-fr.org/minidlna) that the 40FLH7605H isn't able to stream subtitle and that's a one generation older TV. The list also says that other brands do have the ability.

Harcoding implies transcoding the video to merge it with the subtitle text. This is just nonsense as the TV has a great video decoder, providing a great picture.

This is getting ridiculous. You've got a 90% implementation of every feature, just give yourself some motivation and you'll reach that 98% where everything interconnects fine.

youplaboom
08-05-2012, 10:18 AM
But thats a Matter of the Server as the TV is only showning whats been delivered by the Server.


I borrowed an intel i7 with a gigabit ethernet adapter at the office. I installed ubuntu and the minidlna service.
The problem is still the same 1 minute and 10 seconds so that the film starts playing.

It's definitively not a "matter of the server". That's the third piece of hardware and the fourth software that I test with the same result. Draw the necessary conclusions from it.

starterz
08-07-2012, 02:22 PM
Hey

Black screen and no error means, that the TV is waiting for the Server to start, so its lets call it "prebuffering". But thats a Matter of the Server as the TV is only showning whats been delivered by the Server.
About SUbtitles, indeed we don't support that via DLNA because our TV's cant handle 2 Streams the same Time, a Subtitle is a Second Stream.
Only way to get this Solved is to hardcode the Subtitle to the Video.

Thomas

Had to ask a question here Thomas :-)

How are subtitles through DLNA a second stream, and subtitles from USB and CAM/DVB-T not a second stream? What is the type of "stream" we are talking about?

Hardcoding? But please :-) 1-2 hours of recoding just to be able to see subtitles through DLNA? You can't beat that logic :-)

I believe this is completely just a matter of firmware, and not a matter of the TV itself. And again, it is plain non-sense for a TV with a media player. In Craig Ferguson's words...sometimes only a curse word will do.

jgl
08-07-2012, 04:19 PM
Hi, I've a 40PFL8606H working with DLNA without problems. Below I post my confiuration in order to help:

- FW 14.99, but older worked also ok
- Network cable CAT 5E
- Network speed 100 Mbps
- DLNA server Mezzmo, device set to Philips TV 8000 Series 2011
- Transcoding: NO (TV decode). Also tested YES and it works Ok.
- DLNA lists: NO (server sends directly the directory structure)
- DLNA filter by content: YES, if direrctory is music only then it filters the extension, if video do the same and so on.
- Containers: mpg, avi, mkv. Most of them larger than 2 GB, specially HD contents.

I expect than some of my configuration can give you a clue in order to solve the problem.

starterz
08-07-2012, 08:41 PM
My DLNA has been working without problems using any DLNA server I tried - Windows Media Server on Win7, Tversity, Serviio etc. Have my TV connected through ethernet to a Linksys router with Tomato firmware, both laptops (one with WD MyBook) connected through 54Mbps wifi on the same router. Never had any problems with streaming video, except MKVs with non supported (DTS) audio stream.

youplaboom
08-13-2012, 06:55 PM
Hi everybody,
Thanks for your support. Looks like it is homework time. Here are my results.

To make the tests I simplified my network. I borrowed a Zyxel NBG-417N router.
So on my test network there is just the TV + one computer connected to the router.
Two cat 6 cable are used for the test lan.


Hi, I've a 40PFL8606H working with DLNA without problems. Below I post my confiuration in order to help:


I tried to copy the settings of "jgl"

FW 14.99// I'm up to date
Network cable CAT 5E// I took directly cat 6 cable
Network speed 100 Mbps// Ok on that point too. router 100mbps, computer 1000 mbps
DLNA server Mezzmo, device set to Philips TV 8000 Series 2011// Did that too
Transcoding: NO (TV decode). Also tested YES and it works Ok// Did that too
DLNA lists: NO // I didn't find that parameter
DLNA filter by content: YES // I think it's on

The movies still take 50 seconds to start.
By the way, Mezzmo is a very rich featured DLNA server. Absolutely not what I'm seeking.

On the same "simple test network" I performed a test with the ubuntu computer and the minidlna server. It also takes 50 seconds to start.



Never had any problems with streaming video

The streaming itself works fine. How long do you have to wait for a file to be loaded?

Again, thanks for your help

starterz
08-13-2012, 08:24 PM
Aha, ok, sorry for the misunderstanding. I am waiting for just a few seconds before the video/movie starts playing. Mostly avi/xvid. What configuration is the computer running the DLNA server? Is there a difference with different video types? I am using TVersity on two laptops, first one a older pentium dual core, second one with newer (but not very strong) AMD dual core.

I don't see that the network is to be blamed here, it works fine through WiFi at my side (TV with ethernet cable, two laptops on WiFi).

I am guessing that the time is due to some buffering by the DLNA server. It should be interesting to get to the bottom of the problem.

starterz
08-13-2012, 08:25 PM
Had to ask a question here Thomas :-)

How are subtitles through DLNA a second stream, and subtitles from USB and CAM/DVB-T not a second stream? What is the type of "stream" we are talking about?

Hardcoding? But please :-) 1-2 hours of recoding just to be able to see subtitles through DLNA? You can't beat that logic :-)

I believe this is completely just a matter of firmware, and not a matter of the TV itself. And again, it is plain non-sense for a TV with a media player. In Craig Ferguson's words...sometimes only a curse word will do.

Any comments from Philips? What type of streams are we talking about?

youplaboom
08-13-2012, 08:52 PM
Is there a difference with different video types?

It's downloaded xvid, with sizes around 1.5Gb. I don't think I download anything special. I tested and repeated the problem with several files.



I am using TVersity on two laptops, first one a older pentium dual core, second one with newer (but not very strong) AMD dual core.

I made the windows XP serviio and xbmc tests on an amd athlon dual 2 gigaHz cpu.
I made the ubuntu tests on an intel i7 computer. That one is powerfull.
After my test I definitively think the computer power is not an issue. DLNA should work with (even) a little NAS powered by some Atom CPU.
Network monitoring during the stream indicates that it uses around 1 mbit/s. That's not a challenge, even for a weaker CPU.



I don't see that the network is to be blamed here, it works fine through WiFi at my side (TV with ethernet cable, two laptops on WiFi).

Got that, that's why I borrowed another router.
Everything here is now borrowed and new, except the TV (which is new but not borrowed :) )



I am guessing that the time is due to some buffering by the DLNA server. It should be interesting to get to the bottom of the problem.

I'm a bit short of idea actually. If anyone has a clue.

starterz
08-14-2012, 06:57 AM
I am watching such xvids regularly, with buffering no more than 5 secs. So everything looks OK from this side too :-)

Another idea, where are the videos stored? I am using an external WD MyBook, and if it has not been accessed for a longer time I believe it goes into sleep mode, and after you initiate the movie it takes a few more seconds for it to go into regular working mode.

If you feel like experimenting, you can also try to connect the PC and the TV directly with a crossover cable, no router, no switch. Set up fixed IP addresses and try streaming through DLNA.

youplaboom
08-14-2012, 08:52 AM
Another idea, where are the videos stored?


I'm really trying to keep those tests as simple as possible.
I now have got a 20 Gbit sample of 12 movies. That sample is on the main hard disk of each test computer. The computers are not in sleep mode when I perform the tests.



If you feel like experimenting, you can also try to connect the PC and the TV directly with a crossover cable, no router, no switch. Set up fixed IP addresses and try streaming through DLNA.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upnp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simple_Service_Discovery_Protocol


SSDP allows that device to advertise its services to control points on the network. Similarly, when a control point is added to the network, SSDP allows that control point to search for devices of interest on the network.

Is the router the control point or can any device on the network find any other?
If the router is the control point there's no way to get uPnP working without a router.
Any experiences with uPnP, fixed IP and crossover cable ?

Philips, what do you think of my tests? What do you suggest ?

starterz
08-14-2012, 09:02 AM
No, I think that the control point is any device that can "control" content from the media (DLNA) server. For example, one control point is the TV, another would be a mobile device (smartphone), another computer etc.

The router is not of importance here, since the routing part is used for connecting two networks (the internet and your local network). You only use the switch (within your router) for the local network. So you can also use only a switch, without routing. In cases where a switch is not available, two computers can be connected in a local network (example 192.168.1.0/24) directly one to another with a crossover cable. You can use network sharing and gaming this way with no problems.

I am only not sure if DLNA would work through crossover cable, as I have never tried this.

youplaboom
08-20-2012, 06:42 PM
Hi,
Thanks for your comments.



I am only not sure if DLNA would work through crossover cable, as I have never tried this.

Crossover cable works, I tried it. Unfortunately the result is the same: 1 minute of buffering.
TV:

IP:192.168.1.11
mask: 255.255.0.0
gateway:192.168.1.10

Ubuntu (intel i7):

IP:192.168.1.10
mask: 255.255.0.0
gateway:192.168.1.1 (whatever)


What's interesting is that while the movie was loading I monitored CPU and network activity. CPU is like I always say: flat. It's an effortless task for it. Network on the other hand is sending (from the server) with an average of 45mbit and peaks at 60mbit. It look like the TV is definitively buffering that file.

I changed my sample base and bingo, I found a > than 1 GiB file that loaded instantly.

Video codec: x264
Bit rate: 1896 kbps
Resolution: 800x450 @23.976fps
Quality factor: 0.220

Audio codec: AC-3
Audio Bit rate: 384 kbps
Sampling rate: 48 KHz
Channel(s): 6 ch

It also works through my network with my weaker XP computer. It loads instantly.
Looks like depending the format, the TV has to buffer it.
I don't know why this doesn't happen with the USB stick.

Comments from Philips would be more than appreciated.

starterz
08-21-2012, 07:08 AM
You made an excellent test. Now we are sure about DLNA through crossover, sorry that it did not solve your problem.

Default Gateway should not be used at all, as it is used only as a gate to another network (the internet in most cases). You can leave it blank in such cases.

I would expect some buffering to be done by the TV, but not that much. The same happens in the network at my side, but only for a few seconds - not more than 10 secs even when the external WD MyBook has to come out of sleep.

Philips, a mystery to be explained.

youplaboom
08-21-2012, 09:04 AM
Hi,



Default Gateway should not be used at all, as it is used only as a gate to another network (the internet in most cases). You can leave it blank in such cases.
yes I know that. Two reasons for setting it that way.
On the computer I didn't want to play with the etc/network/interfaces which didn't look like the one from the former version. So I used the wizard which requires a gateway.
On the TV, it didn't find the server until I added the computer IP as the gateway IP. Perhaps I didn't wait long enough for the IP scope to be scanned.



I would expect some buffering to be done by the TV, but not that much. The same happens in the network at my side, but only for a few seconds - not more than 10 secs even when the external WD MyBook has to come out of sleep.

It looks like it depends on the file format. You can once try to download a
"Format profile : OpenDML // Format : MPEG-4 Visual" and give it a test.

The problem can also be linked to the version of my TV. I've got a 40PFL8606K, perhaps people using the "H" version don't have that problem.

Toengel
08-21-2012, 09:06 AM
The problem can also be linked to the version of my TV. I've got a 40PFL8606K, perhaps people using the "H" version don't have that problem.

Hi,

both are using the same firmware... so there should be no difference.

Toengel@Alex

starterz
08-21-2012, 09:12 AM
You can once try to download a
"Format profile : OpenDML // Format : MPEG-4 Visual" and give it a test.



Please point me to a file with that format profile that I can download, and I will test it too - so we can compare with the manifestation on 40PFL6606H/12.

All best.