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View Full Version : Your experiences with FW v0.14.99.0 for 8000, 9000 and 21:9 series (2011 models)



Philips - Thomas
07-17-2012, 11:00 AM
Hi

14.99 is on its way, we are currently in Upload Process and i will let you know as soon as it is online.

Here is the Changelog:

· Content from maxdome is distorted in autozoom on a 16:9 set.

· Set blocked when subtitle menu is opened and HbbTV is present.

· Videociety streaming is causing a TV crash.

· TV switches on with Perfect Natural Motion switched on by default. The user has to switch off PNM each time if they don't want it.

· Improvement on picture performance.
(has been renamed as it was bit to tecchie for normal users)

Important: Please perform a COLD REBOOT after updating (when TV is running again) the firmware (goto standby, wait 2 minutes and plug out the power cord for 2-3 minutes)!

Regards
Thomas

kookaburra
07-17-2012, 11:23 AM
Hi

14.99 is on its way, we are currently in Upload Process and i will let you know as soon as it is online.

Here is the Changelog:

· Content from maxdome is distorted in autozoom on a 16:9 set.
· Set blocked when subtitle menu is opened and HbbTV is present.
· Videociety streaming is causing a TV crash.
· TV switches on with Perfect Natural Motion switched on by default. The
user has to switch off PNM each time if they don't want it.
· Wrong values at startup for contrast reserve and loco. When you switch off
dynamic contrast and the PQ profiles "contrast reserve" and "Loco user
value" are set off for that UI level and you restart the set: these
registers should also be off.

Important: Please perform a COLD REBOOT after updating (when TV is running again) the firmware (goto standby, wait 2 minutes and plug out the power cord for 2-3 minutes)!

Regards
Thomas



Hi Thomas.

I´m not completely sure about the issues that you mention above, I don´t really understand all that they are referring to. So I wonder if you can explain if any of them solve the local dimming issue?

Best regards.


Alfonso

21_9_78
07-17-2012, 02:01 PM
hmm still waiting for the norwegian supprt website to update their download link so i can try yet another firmware update.

Espen000
07-17-2012, 02:19 PM
I will try this when i get back home from vacation.

I did not understand the comment regarding dynamic contrast though. Coul you elaborate on that? And why did you remove that comment when editing your post a few hours later?

21_9_78
07-17-2012, 02:21 PM
talked with livechat support and asked why i still cannot download firmware 14.99 and they said its ready but the people who upload it to the support webpage are in china so it will happen soon hehe

21_9_78
07-17-2012, 02:24 PM
a working download link would be cool, se we could comment on update :)

Philips - Thomas
07-17-2012, 02:24 PM
Hi

if you read my initial post:


14.99 is on its way, we are currently in Upload Process and i will let you know as soon as it is online.

everything is already explained.

Thomas

21_9_78
07-17-2012, 02:25 PM
cool thank u :)

kookaburra
07-17-2012, 02:40 PM
1 Content from maxdome is distorted in autozoom on a 16:9 set.
2 Set blocked when subtitle menu is opened and HbbTV is present.
3 Videociety streaming is causing a TV crash.
4 TV switches on with Perfect Natural Motion switched on by default. The
user has to switch off PNM each time if they don’t want it.
5 Wrong values at startup for contrast reserve and loco. When you switch off
dynamic contrast and the PQ profiles “contrast reserve” and “Loco user
value” are set off for that UI level and you restart the set: these
registers should also be off.


What happened to point 5? (Problems dynamic contrast)

21_9_78
07-17-2012, 02:53 PM
i didn't understand what point 5 means. is this the fix for local dimming maybe?

kookaburra
07-17-2012, 02:59 PM
i didn't understand what point 5 means. is this the fix for local dimming maybe?

I did not understand the point 5, but it does not matter because Thomas has released software upgrades and eliminated 14.99 Section 5. Why this point has been removed?

google translator

21_9_78
07-17-2012, 03:07 PM
strange

Philips - Benedickte
07-17-2012, 03:47 PM
Hi all,

Please see point 5:





· Improvement on picture performance.
(has been renamed as it was bit to tecchie for normal users)




Benedickte

21_9_78
07-17-2012, 04:00 PM
wow cant wait for the it to be released i am very excitet to test a firmware that has improvements to picture :) maybe i can finnaly use the local dimming ?

zlatko
07-17-2012, 05:12 PM
· Wrong values at startup for contrast reserve and loco. When you switch off
dynamic contrast and the PQ profiles "contrast reserve" and "Loco user
value" are set off for that UI level and you restart the set: these
registers should also be off.
As I understand reading carefully - this is only an issue in case you switch off dynamic contrast. Does not look like PQ improvement.
@Philips-MODS
Please elaborate on the PQ improvement - users here are tech savvy to understand. Issue with above quote is that it contains some Philips engineers' specific slang that is NOT commonly used terminology.
Thank you in advance.

kookaburra
07-17-2012, 05:27 PM
As I understand reading carefully - this is only an issue in case you switch off dynamic contrast. Does not look like PQ improvement.
@Philips-MODS
Please elaborate on the PQ improvement - users here are tech savvy to understand. Issue with above quote is that it contains some Philips engineers' specific slang that is NOT commonly used terminology.
Thank you in advance.

completely agree

Google translator

Toengel
07-17-2012, 07:19 PM
Hi,

downloads are now available on the servers.

Toengel@Alex

21_9_78
07-17-2012, 07:34 PM
installed :) now begins the exciting part hehe

kookaburra
07-17-2012, 08:11 PM
Very good news. The local dimming works almost perfect. I give it an 8 out of 10, before a 0 out of 10.

google translator

Toengel
07-17-2012, 08:43 PM
Hi,

I have the experience that I don't get black when it should be there.

Example:
16:9 content on 21:9 TV: black bars on the left/right are not black - they are grey. I can "see" that in this area the "backlight" is on. It also does not matter which setting of dynamic backlight is chosen.

Can somebody confirm?

Toengel@Alex

Espen000
07-17-2012, 09:17 PM
Very good news. The local dimming works almost perfect. I give it an 8 out of 10, before a 0 out of 10.

google translator

Thank you for the update. And thanks phillips developers for fixing the issue. Can't wait to get back home to test this!

zlatko
07-17-2012, 09:28 PM
In general I have never had big issues with local dimming operation. Upgraded to 14.99 and watched some parts of Harry Potter 3 - many dark scenes and TV was performing brilliantly. But that is only like 10 minutes observation. Have to use the TV more, to give qualified opinion.

@Toengel
On my 52PFL9606 I don't notice issues with backlight ON under black bars when picture is not 16x9.
EDIT: On further testing LEDs are ON under black bars. Clearly seen when watching slightly of the center of the screen. Had to lower my setting for Contrast&Brightness to 50 and Gamma goes at 2. Black levels are now acceptable, although not perfect as they have(and MUST) be.

Offtopic: Just run a test and counted local dimming zones, because I see some speculations around. Result 16x18(288) individual zones. So it is 120x60 pixel size per zone. Also I notice zones are better shaped/separated in the middle part of the screen, while at the side edges they become more diffused and spread over larger area than expected.

MilkyOne
07-17-2012, 09:39 PM
Hi,

I have the experience that I don't get black when it should be there.

Example:
16:9 content on 21:9 TV: black bars on the left/right are not black - they are grey. I can "see" that in this area the "backlight" is on. It also does not matter which setting of dynamic backlight is chosen.

Can somebody confirm?

Toengel@Alex

I totaly agree, i think local diming is almost off now or very slow to react to the brigthness of the picture, sometimes i can still see it using diferent levels of backlight between dark and light areas but not has much has before.

I think people didn't understood how that function works or simple didn't like it because they were always complaining about it, i mention it here in a previous post that i saw areas of the screen that the backlight was adjusting to the brigthness of the picture, and i thought it was the local diming kicking in.
I admit that sometimes it was a too much sensitive but now looks like my old TV that to make a brigth part of the screen it had to increase the backlight of the all panel, making dark areas gray...

Correct me if i'm wrong but the local dimming is the ability that the panel has to make diferent backlight levels in diferent areas of the screen. If i'm not mistake the panel is divided in 224(more or less) areas where the backlight level can be controlled independently.

Also it looks like the dynamic contrast is using higher levels now.

I'm thinking in downgrading the firmware.... if i don't see anyother improvements. Gonna test it somemore with some movies with lots of dark scenes a test it with white subtitles, but the first impression was not good....

kookaburra
07-17-2012, 10:18 PM
I HAVE ONE AND I CAN ASSURE THAT 58PFL9956 IN MY CASE THE LOCALDIMMING WORKS MUCH BETTER THAN BEFORE. NO LONGER GOES CRAZY IN CERTAIN SCENES. PREVIOUSLY HAD A MODEL 2010 (9955) NOT HAD THESE PROBLEMS ARE SO THAN TALK. FACT IMAGE IS NOW paler than BEFORE, BUT I HAVE FIXED THE BRIGHTNESS DOWN SLIGHTLY, AND RAISING THE ADJUSTMENT OF GAMMA. COULD ALSO OBSERVED THAT WORKS BEST MODE LOCALDIMMIN STANDARD. EXAMPLE IN A DARK SKY SCENE WITH STARS (FILM 2012), DISAPPEAR WITH THE STARS BEST PICTURE ADJUSTMENT BECAUSE too dark, BUT WITH A SET STANDARD LOOKS DEEP SKY BLACK CLEARLY SEEN THE STARS. I DO NOT SEE THIS SET THE SIDELINES IN GREY, BLACK LOOK.

I prefer the VERSION 14.99 NO DOUBT

GOOGLE TRANSLATOR

kookaburra
07-17-2012, 10:24 PM
In general I have never had big issues with local dimming operation. Upgraded to 14.99 and watched some parts of Harry Potter 3 - many dark scenes and TV was performing brilliantly. But that is only like 10 minutes observation. Have to use the TV more, to give qualified opinion.

@Toengel
On my 52PFL9606 I don't notice issues with backlight ON under black bars when picture is not 16x9.

Offtopic: Just run a test and counted local dimming zones, because I see some speculations around. Result 16x18(288) individual zones. So it is 120x60 pixel size per zone. Also I notice zones are better shaped/separated in the middle part of the screen, while at the side edges they become more diffused and spread over larger area than expected.

HOW DO THE TEST OF LOCAL AREAS DIMMING?

Best Regards

BjornRuud
07-17-2012, 10:37 PM
I did a couple of hours of testing tonight on my 46PFL9706T and had good results:

Local dimming:
- Issues that were clearly bugs (horizontally dimmed bars and strong fluctuations) seem to be gone.
- Works better than before. Seems more responsive.
- Abstract computer graphics, like the Boxee GUI, has been problematic but now only has minor issues.
- Subtitles don't affect/confuse dimming anymore, at least on my tests.
- There are still issues with zone fluctuations in some scenes, but the effect is less pronounced compared to how it was in the previous firmware. You can test it with "The Dark Knight" at 26:29 where there is a dark scene where the camera rotates around the characters.
- The contrast gain and discoloring that occurred when a zone transitioned from very dark to very bright is almost gone on movie material. It is still present on some Xbox 360 games, but a lot better than before.
- Dirty screen effect (DSE) is still there, but as with the other issues, rarer and less visible than before.

I haven't been able to confirm if the audio crackle bug (over optical out) has been fixed since it happens randomly and rarely, but so far so good.

The PNM bug has not been a problem for me, but I tested it now and it seems to work as intended.

All in all a very good update. Nice work!

However, some criticism is in order. It took way too long to get this fix out. Also, refusing to acknowledge a problem does not make it go away. I have been told by both Philips and the service repair shop that nothing is wrong, and lo and behold, here we are with a firmware update that fixes those non-existant problems. That is not good customer service, especially when the issues were well documented.

MilkyOne
07-17-2012, 11:17 PM
I have to be honest and change my previous opinion, after a few adjustments on the backlight level(Change from 70 to 50) and using HD movie material, the blacks that i loved are back, but i still get the feeling sometimes that the tv is a little bit slower changing the level of the black light when changing from a bright to a dark scene. But it can be psicologic. :P

However i still notice by using the active control option, that the tv is using more dynamic contrast, but adjusting the levels in the backlight contrast and video contrast options seems to resolved the issue.

Gonna watch some more tv, but for now i apologize for my previous post, because looks like this time Philips really made some improvements in the image performance/quality with this firmware.

Bjornruud - I totaly agree with you, philips has to improve his comunication channels with customers, whether it's thru this forum or customer support line and try to always give acurate feedback, and not just stay in silence. No/Wrong feedback = Unhappy customers!

Ps.: Gonna ask santa the fix for the sleep timer bug and a short cut for it(maybe thru the green remote button in the power savings options) for christmas! :D

21_9_78
07-17-2012, 11:59 PM
the new firmware is super good just watched through the first lord of the rings movie and had dynamic back lighting set to stamdard and it is true about 8 of 10. I think the best picture setting is still to active but it depends on the movie so i prefer standard. i havent tried best power yet. the pbm fix also seem to work. so basicly very happy tonight, well done philips it is the first time i ever feel my tv is a real top model :)
this is bt far the best firmware release, its like getting a new tv .)

zlatko
07-18-2012, 05:13 AM
WOW! Overwhelmingly positive feedback! :) Great to hear that! I will test when I am back home today.

@kookaburra
I counted number of individually controlled zones using test file "Backlight test DivX dot2.avi" . It is a white fat dot moving horizontally and vertically on black background. In the dark you can see how the zones light up sequentially when white dot passes over them.

mduran
07-18-2012, 05:25 AM
Then there is only one issue left for me, That is the autozoom or autofill issue. If I start TV on HDMI1 and there is a 4:3 scene. The TV does not scale or autofill the screen. If I zap to HDMI2 and back, the TV automatically removes the 4:3 bars on the side and fills the screen with picture....

kookaburra
07-18-2012, 07:02 AM
WOW! Overwhelmingly positive feedback! :) Great to hear that! I will test when I am back home today.

@kookaburra
I counted number of individually controlled zones using test file "Backlight test DivX dot2.avi" . It is a white fat dot moving horizontally and vertically on black background. In the dark you can see how the zones light up sequentially when white dot passes over them.


Zlatko thank you very much. Will search the file for testing.

zlatko
07-18-2012, 08:07 AM
@kookaburra
You can download file from here: http://db.tt/dOtGQKyJ
But its only usability is to count LED zones. It is known they are 224 for 46" and 288 for 52". There were speculations on forum boards, that 9606 had only 112 zones. Which I witness with my own eyes is not true.

21_9_78
07-18-2012, 08:12 AM
well everyone didnt get to bed before 0430am watching the "new" 59pfl9956 for way to long. looking forward to getting back form work to watch more movies with local dimming :)

kookaburra
07-18-2012, 08:16 AM
@kookaburra
You can download file from here: http://db.tt/dOtGQKyJ
But its only usability is to count LED zones. It is known they are 224 for 46" and 288 for 52". There were speculations on forum boards, that 9606 had only 112 zones. Which I witness with my own eyes is not true.

Great. This afternoon we will check the areas of my 9956.

Thanks Zlatko

inthehouse
07-18-2012, 10:02 AM
Hi all,

The 58PFL9956H/12 has been running for some time with new firmware 0.14.99,
Setting the "best picture" still has from time to image lightning. Although not as it used to (permanently) but it is sometimes present.
The "standard" to them now.
I mean that the next one with the firmware refine still can.
In any case, Philips is on the right track. I fit very well the new firmware.
Been the overexposure of individual objects in the image (for example, faces) are also eliminated with this firmware.
I do not mean that the black is so tired ... must be tested further.
The isf calibration constant from the Software Update unaffected.
The PNM bug is history.

Up to now, a good job in my opinion.

regards

Goggle translation

BjornRuud
07-18-2012, 02:09 PM
I see some are using "best picture" and some "standard" for dynamic contrast (local dimming). Does anyone know what the difference between the settings are? What parameters do they affect?

zlatko
07-18-2012, 02:13 PM
@BjornRuud
When I was setting up my TV set, I noticed that with "standard" I was getting best results in distinguishing both ends of the grey scale. "Best picture" dims too aggressively the dark areas, making the blacks merge.

CrisRoda
07-18-2012, 08:26 PM
I wil test now i have 40pfl8606 and im exicting to experience the good new, i good idea is to share your best settings. ill will give mine, now is testing time.

BjornRuud
07-18-2012, 08:34 PM
Sadly the crackling (or digital noise) over the optical audio port is still there. It sounds like a glitch in a damaged audio file. It seems to be even rarer than before but is very annoying in a quiet scene. I can't reproduce the problem as it happens randomly. During 4 hours of testing various sources and material it has so far only happened once. Previously it usually happened 1-2 times per hour on average.

My setup: BluRay player, Boxee Box and Xbox 360 all downmix to stereo PCM and output audio via HDMI to TV. Audio then goes via optical out to DAC and amp. The crackling happens with all audio sources. There was a sync problem with Dolby Digital audio a while back, it might be related?

@zlatko
Yeah I noticed that too, but in several dark scenes I tested it wasn't a problem so I'm leaning towards "best picture" for now. It seems to work well on a wide selection of material.

pjoslo
07-19-2012, 09:12 AM
My experiences on 46pfl9706:

PNM bug fixed!:)
Backlight dimming is a lot better - not perfect, but much improved!
Need to recalibrate set as brightness/contrast appear to have been altered - the values are of course the same, but the behaviour is different.

regards, PJ

CrisRoda
07-19-2012, 01:06 PM
40pfl8606

-Backlight dimming is a lot better - not perfect, but much improved!
-PNM bug, how can you now is working?

My settings:

Contrast 56, ligth 51, sharp 3, dynamic contrast fo now "best picture", PNM max, noise max, mpeg max, gamma 0, most is active and set to max, contrast mim...

Doengel
07-20-2012, 06:15 AM
46pfl9706k/02 on 14.99 with HTS9221

- yesterday evening i watched a blu ray disc. After 5 minutes the TV turned off on itself but the sound was still there because it came out of the speakers of the HTS. Then i tried to turn on the TV again. The first attempt failed. I only saw the Philips Logo and right after that the TV turned off again. At second attempt the TV kept turned on.

- sometimes i still see the message "encrypted channel" on HD+ channels.

- still sporadic picture artefacts every couple minutes and sounddrops with Dolby Digital on HD+ channels. With an external DVB-C receiver i do not experience these issues on the affected channels

- picture quality has much improved from my personal point of view

Manuel
07-20-2012, 08:29 AM
Most of the times it's not a good idea put all digital adj to work on "maximum values".......


40pfl8606

-Backlight dimming is a lot better - not perfect, but much improved!
-PNM bug, how can you now is working?

My settings:

Contrast 56, ligth 51, sharp 3, dynamic contrast fo now "best picture", PNM max, noise max, mpeg max, gamma 0, most is active and set to max, contrast mim...

nnay07
07-21-2012, 11:32 AM
To all: what image settings are you using? Which presets, sharpness, gamma, video contrast, brightness,...? Any of calibrated its TV?

inthehouse
07-22-2012, 07:19 AM
Hi nnay07 :)

Calibration settings for Cinema 21:9 Platinum 58PFL9956 (german)

ISF Day @274cd/m² @D65 Gamma @2.0
Kontr. der Hintergrundbel.: 74
Helligkeit: 50
Farbe: 50
Schärfe: 1
Rauschunterdr.: Aus
Farbton personalisiert Rot: 111, Grün: 97, Blau: 75, R-BL: 3, G-BL: 0, B-BL: -6
Nat. Motion: aus
Clear LCD: ein
Super Resolution: ein
perf. Kontr.: aus
Dyn. Hintergr.Bel: Standard
MPEG Art.Unterdr: aus
Farboptimierung.: aus
Gamma: -2
Videokontrast: 90
Lichtsensor: aus
Bildschirmänder: 0



ISF Night @130cd/m² @D65 / Gamma @2.2
Kontr. der Hintergrundbel.: 40
Helligkeit: 50
Farbe: 50
Schärfe: 1
Rauschunterdr.: Aus
Farbton personalisiert Rot: 110, Grün: 97, Blau: 79, R-BL: 2, G-BL: 0, B-BL: -6
Nat. Motion: aus
Clear LCD: ein
Super Resolution: ein
perf. Kontr.: aus
Dyn. Hintergr.Bel: Standard
MPEG Art.Unterdr: aus
Farboptimierung.: aus
Gamma: 1
Videokontrast: 80
Lichtsensor: aus
Bildschirmänder: 0

zlatko
07-22-2012, 08:19 AM
After 14.99 I feel performance of backlight dimming is more subtle. Previously when you have larger darker areas with numerous small bright elements spread on it, the whole dark zone looked inhomogenous, with varying shades of the background. Now such zone are more evenly colored. I think that is better.
Below are my 52PFL9606 settings, unchanged from first setting up the TV:
Backlight contrast: 70
Brightness: 54
Color: 56
Sharpness: 4
Noise red.: Off
Tint: Normal
PNM: Medium
Clear LCD: On
Super res.: On
Perfect contrast: Medium
Dynamic backlight: Standard
MPEG art. red.: Minimum
Colour enhancement: Medium
Gamma: 1
Video contrast: 77
Light sensor: On

This settings are OK for my eyes, I watch 90% HD, and don't care about SD performance. Hence sharpness is way UP.

Bert
07-22-2012, 10:34 PM
Great firmware update, good job Philips !
Backlight dimming better + PNM bug fixed

My settings for my 46PFL8606:
ISF DAY adjustment:
Backlight contrast: 60
Brightness: 49
Color: 51
Sharpness: 2
Noise red.: Off
Tint: Personal : 126/96/64/0/-1/-1
PNM: Off
Clear LCD: On
Super res.: On
Perfect contrast: Minimum
Dynamic backlight: Best picture
MPEG art. red.: Off
Colour enhancement: Minimum
Gamma: 0
Video contrast: 84
ISF menu: 2nd in the list => HDMI-PC level brightness: Off (=standard selected in ISF settings)
Light sensor: Off

CrisRoda
07-22-2012, 10:41 PM
Afert this update and seen some definitions, the result are these.
Like zlatko said is dificult too have good settings for SD and HD at the same time, and it also depends on the source, tv or bluray,Ps3, mediacenter, etc...maybe in the future Philips takes this in consideration, thanks Philips for the good job, but you can do better, i know it.
Below are my 40PFL8606 settings TV:
Smart Picture: Personal
Backlight contrast: 56
Brightness: 51
Color: 34
Sharpness: 6
Noise red.: medium
Tint: Personal
R Gain 126
G Gain 96
B Gain 88
PNM: Max
Clear LCD: On
Super res.: On
Perfect contrast: Medium
Dynamic backlight: Best Picture
MPEG art. red.: Medium
Colour enhancement: off
Gamma: 0
Video contrast: 95
Light sensor: On
Picture format: widescreen
edges : 4

zlatko
07-23-2012, 09:44 AM
It is still early to generalize, but I see some very similar settings for 8&9-series TV sets from different owners. At least for the major parameters:

1. Direct LED(9 series)
Contrast: ~ 70
Brightness: ~50
Color: ~50
Video contrast: ~ 80
Dynamic backlight: Standard

2. Edge LED(8 series)
Contrast: ~ 60
Brightness: ~50
Color: ~40
Video contrast: ~ 85
Dynamic backlight: Best picture

These might be a good starting point for everyone. Other parameters like PNM, Sharpness are up to everybody's taste.
Of course we have to gather more user data.

CrisRoda
07-24-2012, 08:24 AM
I have tested the settings from Bert, and made some changes, and i liked, but like everyone are saying the PNM bug solve, but what they Philips solve is the option off, and that is what is supose to do, but i used it on, for SD channels it improved a lot the image quality its like it convert to HD, but it still not good, PHILIPS please could you improve this feature, is still creating interference wiht subtitles, logos, everything that is in a different layer, and on fast scenes is worst and dark too, it create shadows around objects and drag them too. Thanks and continum the good work.

buyukbang
07-24-2012, 09:18 AM
A professionally calibrated settings for 58PFL9956 on the latest firmware!
This is what I'm looking for my 52PFL9606 :( I'm not sure same settings will fit to my TV, anyone having any idea or have same professioanlly calibrated/measured settings for 52PFL9606?

BTW, I have a VU+ digital satellite receiver and Mac Mini so watch MKV/Bluray ISO . My experience shows that TV and bluray content needs different settings. I like vivid colors with very high contrast while watching TV (football matches, live, shows, etc) but this settings make blurays awful. Instead I like more balanced settings like in Cinema Mod. However I still not fully satisfied with the default cinema mod setting, this is why I'm asking desperately a professionally calibrated setting.


Hi nnay07 :)

Calibration settings for Cinema 21:9 Platinum 58PFL9956 (german)

ISF Day @274cd/m² @D65 Gamma @2.0
Kontr. der Hintergrundbel.: 74
Helligkeit: 50
Farbe: 50
Schärfe: 1
Rauschunterdr.: Aus
Farbton personalisiert Rot: 111, Grün: 97, Blau: 75, R-BL: 3, G-BL: 0, B-BL: -6
Nat. Motion: aus
Clear LCD: ein
Super Resolution: ein
perf. Kontr.: aus
Dyn. Hintergr.Bel: Standard
MPEG Art.Unterdr: aus
Farboptimierung.: aus
Gamma: -2
Videokontrast: 90
Lichtsensor: aus
Bildschirmänder: 0



ISF Night @130cd/m² @D65 / Gamma @2.2
Kontr. der Hintergrundbel.: 40
Helligkeit: 50
Farbe: 50
Schärfe: 1
Rauschunterdr.: Aus
Farbton personalisiert Rot: 110, Grün: 97, Blau: 79, R-BL: 2, G-BL: 0, B-BL: -6
Nat. Motion: aus
Clear LCD: ein
Super Resolution: ein
perf. Kontr.: aus
Dyn. Hintergr.Bel: Standard
MPEG Art.Unterdr: aus
Farboptimierung.: aus
Gamma: 1
Videokontrast: 80
Lichtsensor: aus
Bildschirmänder: 0

zlatko
07-24-2012, 06:56 PM
Hi,

I have the experience that I don't get black when it should be there.

Example:
16:9 content on 21:9 TV: black bars on the left/right are not black - they are grey. I can "see" that in this area the "backlight" is on. It also does not matter which setting of dynamic backlight is chosen.

Can somebody confirm?

Toengel@Alex
At first I replied to you that I do not notice such behavior, but after spending some more time with TV I think sometimes I notice backlight being ON under black bars. It seems not always, but I don't remember ever feeling black bars are not completely black before 14.99.
It will be good anyone of the mods give us some more details on new picture optimisations in 14.99.

Toengel
07-24-2012, 07:07 PM
Hi,

if you have a 16:9 TV, I suggest to test a 4:3 broadcast... I have the STRONG feeling, that I don't have local dimming anymore on my 21:9 - for me, it's more a global dimming now: if the broadcast picture becomes dark, the black borders (on the left/right) become black. If then the broadcast picture become coloured again, one can see, that the backlight behind the black bars is switched on. To investigate: just go 0.5 meter in front of your TV and try to watch from the side at the black borders...

Can you somehow confirm?

PS: try to test in a dark room

Toengel@Alex

Update:

I did take some photos. I always made one capture of the broadcast (where one can see the "grey" bars at the left/right) and shortly afterwards I opened the home menu and the bars become black (means that in this case the backlight is really off).

First capture
1274
First capture + Home Menu
1275
Second capture
1272
Second capture + Home Menu
1273
Third capture
1270
Third capture + Home Menu
1271

zlatko
07-24-2012, 08:49 PM
@Toengel
I did some testing myself, although I was not able to play extensively with the TV(52PFL9606).
My observations:
1. Black bars have backlight turned ON under them. Definitely. I think it was NOT like this in 14.98.
2. I clearly see local dimming working. Tested with moving white dot on black background.
3. I noticed when looking at 4:3 content with black bars, that when subtitles are shown the whole horizontal lower band of the screen becomes lighter, even the parts of this "band" that are not picture, but black bars. Which is WRONG for a local dimming TV. If it is solid black, then be it. Turn OFF LEDs under the black bars!
So Philips engineers implemented some different algorythm for local dimming, making it a combination of local + global + bigger zones. With it you seem to NOT get the usual true blacks from previous versions.
I will continue to monitor 14.99, but I am really thinking about downgrading. I don't like the greys that the TV now produces instead of BLACKs!
Please everybody - do some observation and share here.

kookaburra
07-25-2012, 06:57 AM
Hi,

if you have a 16:9 TV, I suggest to test a 4:3 broadcast... I have the STRONG feeling, that I don't have local dimming anymore on my 21:9 - for me, it's more a global dimming now: if the broadcast picture becomes dark, the black borders (on the left/right) become black. If then the broadcast picture become coloured again, one can see, that the backlight behind the black bars is switched on. To investigate: just go 0.5 meter in front of your TV and try to watch from the side at the black borders...

Can you somehow confirm?

PS: try to test in a dark room

Toengel@Alex

Update:

I did take some photos. I always made one capture of the broadcast (where one can see the "grey" bars at the left/right) and shortly afterwards I opened the home menu and the bars become black (means that in this case the backlight is really off).

First capture
1274
First capture + Home Menu
1275
Second capture
1272
Second capture + Home Menu
1273
Third capture
1270
Third capture + Home Menu
1271




It is true that in certain circumstances, black is not deep, but in general has improved a lot. Prior to me there was never black and I had to disable local dimming. As you will see most people are very happy with this update as far as local dimming is concerned, since before it was impossible to watch TV with this feature enabled. What surprises me is that I have not seen any comments on this TV yours (9956) prior to this update. I believe that with previous versions will work well the local dimmin, the only serious in this forum. If you really did not have this problem before it is clear that our TV has a hardware problem and not software.

Moving on, in addition to this specific problem with blacks, I observed the flases still appear from time to time, and the wallpaper pattern is still there. They should also address the issue of image brightness, is now very high, even adjusting the GAMMA to -4, this could be one of the reasons why blacks are more gray than black (at times).

Google Translator1276

Toengel
07-25-2012, 07:07 AM
Hi,

well - I had a 9955 before. And there it was definitely black on that 9955 and the backlight was off in the black-bar-area! I got the 9956 with FW 14.99 (or I got the 9956 and updated immediately the 14.99). It's now a step backward regarding the local dimming / black level... that's really sad.

Toengel@Alex

kookaburra
07-25-2012, 07:21 AM
I've had previously 9955. I have always said on this forum that the 9955 model looks much better than 9956. I am complaining about the problems with this tv from day one, (local dimming, background pattern, centerline clearer ...) You see what I say seeing comments and complaints that I have this forum since September 2011 . Philips has never been clear, nor has recognized these problems. I hope now that you have this TV, you can check these and other faults, and I have the hope that Philips will make you more attention than the rest of Forero, as I say removing the extra features and 3d, the 2010 model is much better. I hope that Philips read your comments and finish solve those problems.

Google Translator

limpitakis
07-25-2012, 07:43 AM
Hi,

well - I had a 9955 before. And there it was definitely black on that 9955 and the backlight was off in the black-bar-area! I got the 9956 with FW 14.99 (or I got the 9956 and updated immediately the 14.99). It's now a step backward regarding the local dimming / black level... that's really sad.

Toengel@Alex


58PFL9956H
I can confirm that .099 firmware does not give me the blacks that I was used to at any earlier version.
I would like to go back to .098.
Could you please let me know if 0.98 is still somehow uploaded?
Thank you
Nick

zlatko
07-25-2012, 07:50 AM
@kookaburra
I am not questioning many users here are happy with 14.99 and the changes in local dimming it introduced.
I have never had issues with local dimming, it was working very well for my taste, producing spectacular blacks. Now I see greys, instead of blacks and that is not something I like. I actually see improvement only when I put info bar with EPG data from my sat. receiver on screen. As it is black letters over light grey, with some transparency background, previously local dimming was kicking in, trying to lower light behind black letters and lines, thus making the entire grey background look uneven, with darker patches. Now it is smooth.
Overall 14.99 brought regression in PQ for my taste.

@limpitakis
I have both 14.97 and 14.98 back home. Will upload them to dropbox and post a link for everybody willing to downgrade.

kookaburra
07-25-2012, 07:52 AM
58PFL9956H
I can confirm that .099 firmware does not give me the blacks that I was used to at any earlier version.
I would like to go back to .098.
Could you please let me know if 0.98 is still somehow uploaded?
Thank you
Nick



limpitakis, Toengel: None of you have had problems with local dimming. Please see the videos I've posted this problem I have since September 2011 and that most of your fellow members also have confirmed that they had.
Google translator.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9vkZIhpS8E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dM6I9pMwNVY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaRHeh9vkIU

limpitakis
07-25-2012, 08:00 AM
Unfortunatelly I do not have older software(s) any more.
Nick

buyukbang
07-25-2012, 08:20 AM
My experience with ..99 is like below:

I watched "the Raven" last night, a movie with lots of dark scenes, I noticed adjusting process of local dimming is more noticeable than 0.98. For example, on a dark scene, the actor makes very slow movements where he sat down (fixed place), but even with these slow movements dimming of the darkness of the room was changing (being adjusted) continuously, which gives wrong and distracting picture drawings.

However I cannot confirm "the grey" issue, I checked black bars on 4:3 content, on my STB menu, etc. They all had strong and beautiful blacks as before. ( I'm using Using Cinema Mode with Local Dimming set as Standart without any other modification)

But I'm still not happy with the distracting (imho, buggy implementation) dimming adjustment. I'll switch back to previous firmware and test this movie again.

BTW, I'm not interested with PNM improvements: I always use TV as PNM deactivated since I don't like what it does on the picture.

@zlatko,
I'm also waiting for your 0.98 upload, I'll switch back to previous firmware. Thanks !

MilkyOne
07-25-2012, 09:10 AM
It is true that in certain circumstances, black is not deep, but in general has improved a lot. Prior to me there was never black and I had to disable local dimming. As you will see most people are very happy with this update as far as local dimming is concerned, since before it was impossible to watch TV with this feature enabled. What surprises me is that I have not seen any comments on this TV yours (9956) prior to this update. I believe that with previous versions will work well the local dimmin, the only serious in this forum. If you really did not have this problem before it is clear that our TV has a hardware problem and not software.

Moving on, in addition to this specific problem with blacks, I observed the flases still appear from time to time, and the wallpaper pattern is still there. They should also address the issue of image brightness, is now very high, even adjusting the GAMMA to -4, this could be one of the reasons why blacks are more gray than black (at times).

Google Translator1276

Like i reported initialy i also notice the same problem with the black bars, but after i change my backlight contrast value from 70 to 50 i rarely notice it.

Just a little note you say you put the gamma to "-4" and what i think what you should do its to put it to a positive level like 4, because minus levels make the image more bright and black become more gray, at least in my 46pfl9706. But i agree that after the upgrade i had to adjust my picture settings again because the constrast and brightness levels changed to higher values i think.

Toengel
07-25-2012, 09:20 AM
Hi,

from my understanding of Local Dimming: If I have two areas about 20cm x 50cm on the left and right, which does not contain any image information (16:9 content on 21:9 screen), then the backlight should be off - independently which setting is chosen (of course not, if dyn. backlight is off)!

Toengel@Alex

kookaburra
07-25-2012, 09:20 AM
MilkyOne@

True, it is a mistake on my part. The GAMMA I have it set to 4

GOOGLE TRANSLATOR

zlatko
07-25-2012, 09:56 AM
@MilkyOne
When settings contrast&brightness on my screen I use greyscale image. I adjust these settings until I have the lowest values, that allow me to distinguish both ends of the greyscale. I want to distinguish pitch black from 2% black. Same with whites.
EDIT: I had to set up my picture again after 14.99. Using greycale pattern I found that now a contrast&brightness at 50 are OK and I can distinguish all shades of grey. With 14.98 it was different. I followed your example and now I rarely get distracted by grey borders. But still I prefer black to be black.

@Toengel
Same feelings here - black bars should be BLACK!

MilkyOne
07-25-2012, 10:26 AM
@MilkyOne
When settings contrast&brightness on my screen I use greyscale image. I adjust these settings until I have the lowest values, that allow me to distinguish both ends of the greyscale. I want to distinguish pitch black from 2% black. Same with whites.

@Toengel
Same here - black bars should be BLACK!

I agree that black should be black. I and another user reported the problem with the black bars here just after the firmware was released, but now i'm going to speculate but perhaps you guys can test but if the local dimming area is not totally fill with the black bar, lets says that just 1 row or column of pixels have picture, that dimming area will have to be activated. I say this because normally the bars have some little diferences in size depending on the content that is being play.
I have notice that in some programs the black bars backlight changes more often than in others.

What i was trying to say in the other post was that after some testing i noticed that the values of brightness/contrast in this firmware were changed and after a few settings change, at this moment i don't have that problem so often. I also notice that the dynamic contrast is using higher values even when using the standard setting. I check this thru the active control option were you can check the levels of several settings that the tv is using.

But perhaps the behavior is diferent from model to model since i have notice that most of ppl complaining have a diferente model of me. I'm with the 46pfl9706h model.

Toengel
07-25-2012, 11:31 AM
Hi,

when watching 16:9 content (unscaled) on 21:9 screen, there is no content (even not a pixel column) on the left/right handed "black" areas...

Toengel@Alex

zlatko
07-25-2012, 11:53 AM
@MilkyOne
As Toengel noted we are speaking here about black areas without a picture in them - they must be as black as possible. There is no video information in them.
Also - I agree with you that if in a dark zone there is even lit 1 pixel the LEDs under it must be ON. But on my 52PFL9606 with its 288 controlled zones each zone is like 7x4cm. So only such a zone shall be lit when needed, not chunks like the black bars - 20x60 cm.
And our TV sets are very similar - I have 52PFL9606 which is 9706 minus the motheye filter(which I regret dearly!)

CrisRoda
07-25-2012, 11:58 AM
I agree with all off you i have the same problems, but for better help for Philips is maybe to show the problem, with pictures (jpg) and with the settings that you are using, ill will do this in this weekend,and all off us should do this too. toghether we will help for better understanding and improvements.

zlatko
07-25-2012, 12:04 PM
@CrisRoda
It is up to Philips mods here to participate in such discussions and be a connection between us and the engineers. I don't feel more pictures are needed - there are already provided and we can made more if Philips needs them. We just confirm the regression(according to our understanding for good PQ) we experience. I think it is affecting local dimming 9-series TV sets. Can not speak about Edge LED 8-series.

Toengel
07-25-2012, 12:06 PM
Hi,

if you have time, you can just switch between the different "dynamic backlight" options - the difference is almost not perceivable im my case.

Toengel@Alex

kookaburra
07-25-2012, 12:12 PM
Hi,

if you have time, you can just switch between the different "dynamic backlight" options - the difference is almost not perceivable im my case.

Toengel@Alex


It shows very well the difference if you make changes to a dark prevention image. For my taste the best position is standard, best movie burning oscurecedemasiado whites and dark areas, so that definition is lost in shades of gray in between.

Google Translator

Toengel
07-25-2012, 12:13 PM
Hi,

sorry - I forgot to mentioned that I meant the black-bar-areas... ;-)

Toengel@Alex

kookaburra
07-25-2012, 12:23 PM
Ok. Anyway you do not you break the head with evidence. Who needs to do the tests is Philips, which is sure who is reading these comments, confirm that you have checked the reported bugs, (which has done so far with local dimming) and their solution. This would reassure the minds of many. I remember almost a year ago that I complain of these problems, which Philips has never recognized, and curiously take an update that solves (80%) there was a problem ...

Hopefully not delay another year at 14.99 refine the software under my point of view is much improved to 14.98.

google translator

zlatko
07-25-2012, 03:34 PM
Below are links to 14.97 and 14.98 firmware for 8&9 2011 series:

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/73234139/autorun_0.14.97.upg
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/73234139/autorun_0.14.98.upg

They are still uploading to my dropbox account, because connection is slow, they will be OK in 1 hour.

EDIT: 14.97 and 14.98 are uploaded.

buyukbang
07-25-2012, 03:37 PM
I found .98 in my recycle bin and started upload for the forum members right now. You are faster than me ;)


Below are link to 14.97 and 14.98 firmware for 8&9 2011 series:

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/73234139/autorun_0.14.97.upg
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/73234139/autorun_0.14.98.upg

They are still uploading to my dropbox account, because connection is slow, they will be OK in 1 hour.

kookaburra
07-25-2012, 03:54 PM
You should check first if you can download this version, as not all software versions can be downloaded. Some may damage the TV, I can confirm a second hand. I really did with the previous 9955 model and right service. I would not do so lightly.

google translator

buyukbang
07-25-2012, 04:10 PM
I downgraded back to 0.98 without any problem, if you mean this ?


You should check first if you can download this version, as not all software versions can be downloaded. Some may damage the TV, I can confirm a second hand. I really did with the previous 9955 model and right service. I would not do so lightly.

google translator

Philips - Thomas
07-25-2012, 04:25 PM
Hi

What he was saying is that Downgrading without Instructions can possibly harm the TV.
If the TV is somehow damaged this is not within Warranty so before you Downgrade, you should always contact your local Support.

Regards
Thomas

zlatko
07-25-2012, 04:35 PM
@Philips - Thomas
We appreciate your warning about downgrade Thomas.
But as this is already a 70+ posts thread about 14.99 black level regression - care to comment? It will be a lot better than just warning us.
Thank you in advance.

Philips - Thomas
07-25-2012, 05:29 PM
Hi

sure i can comment.
We do have users here reporting that local Dimming is working fine for them, we have users reporting that it has been much improved, which was the reason for us to make the changes.
Now we also have users, reporting to us that it was better before.

I saw some Photos from Toengel already and asked him for some more Details.
Thats the same i can ask all other who are complaining about the Black or local Dimming.
Share Photos and Picture Settings.

Regards
Thomas

zlatko
07-25-2012, 07:31 PM
@Philips - Thomas
Thank you Thomas! :)
That was my idea - to give us feedback, that you have noticed our posts and ask for additional info if you need it.
Of course I am even not demanding changes, as it looks like many users feel there is improvement in local dimming operation. For me a discussion and some explanation what had been changed and why will be nice.
Everyone can go back to earlier version if he feels it suits his taste better. That way we are all happy.
Thank you once again for taking your time to engage in this thread!

mk81
07-25-2012, 08:06 PM
I can confirm the problems mentioned by Toengel with my 9956 using activated dynamic backlight settings and activated perfect contrast.

Moreover and worst: it seems to me that the "moving artefacts", which I almost only knew from the 9955 up to today, now are also appearing much more often and painfully more visible on the 9956.


12841285
1286

9956 26.07.2012 TV HD

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxQ3J4qD_4Q&feature=youtu.be

2nd Video: top right corner

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6jpI0MBpSg&feature=youtu.be

buyukbang
07-26-2012, 05:30 AM
"moving backlight artefacts", I think this is the right term for what I want to express in my previous report here in previous page (http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?6621-Your-experiences-with-FW-v0-14-99-0-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-(2011-models)&p=37221&viewfull=1#post37221). Yes, this was very bad and very distracting in 0.99 and I downgraded mainly because of that issue.

@Philips, please roll back what you did for Local Dimming logic in 0.99 and preserve other fixes in the next firmware built.



I can confirm the problems mentioned by Toengel with my 9956 using activated local dimming settings.
Moreover it seems to me that the "moving backlight artefacts", which I almost only knew from the 9955 up to today, now are also appearing more often and more visible on the 9956...(video)
12841285
1286

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9lRJFx9p6o&feature=youtu.be

zlatko
07-28-2012, 08:23 AM
I have been experimenting a bit with setting after 14.99. Lowered backlight to 50 and brightness at 52, gamma at 2. Now black levels a A LOT better, picture seem a bit darker overall may be. Can't complain about blacks performance while watching Olympic opening yesterday. Will continue observing before I decide to downgrade.

inthehouse
07-28-2012, 10:54 AM
A professionally calibrated settings for 58PFL9956 on the latest firmware!
This is what I'm looking for my 52PFL9606 :( I'm not sure same settings will fit to my TV, anyone having any idea or have same professioanlly calibrated/measured settings for 52PFL9606?

BTW, I have a VU+ digital satellite receiver and Mac Mini so watch MKV/Bluray ISO . My experience shows that TV and bluray content needs different settings. I like vivid colors with very high contrast while watching TV (football matches, live, shows, etc) but this settings make blurays awful. Instead I like more balanced settings like in Cinema Mod. However I still not fully satisfied with the default cinema mod setting, this is why I'm asking desperately a professionally calibrated setting.

Hi,


I posted the settings have been calibrated by myself @ D65 Rec709 :)

DT-94 colorimeter, AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray, Panasonic DMP-BDT110 @HDMI 1080p

Link settings: http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?6621-Your-experiences-with-FW-v0-14-99-0-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-%282011-models%29&p=36995&viewfull=1#post36995.

Kolorimeter DT-94, AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray, Panasonic DMP-BDT110 @HDMI @1080p

Here, the measurement protocols for example for isf night...

http://www.abload.de/thumb/philips21_93pd23.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=philips21_93pd23.jpg)


Black is black with Firmware 14.99 @my 21:9 platinum.


regards

Google translation

mengaraf
07-29-2012, 11:00 AM
37pfl9606

Yesterday evening i watched a digital channel.
After 75 minutes the TV turned off on itself after green lines, ambilight flash and acoustic noise for 5 seconds.
Then i tried to turn on the TV again. I did'n see the Philips Logo.
After 15 minutes the TV turned off on itself again (without green lines, ambilight flash and acoustic noise)
I turn on the TV again and I did'n see the Philips Logo again.

CrisRoda
07-29-2012, 04:14 PM
Below are my 40PFL8606 settings TV:
Smart Picture: ISF Day
Backlight contrast: 56
Brightness: 40
Color: 32
Sharpness: 3
Noise red.: medium
Tint: Custom
R Gain 117
G Gain 87
B Gain 75
R-BL: 2
G-BL: -2
B-BL: 1
PNM: Max
Clear LCD: On
Super res.: On
Perfect contrast: Minimum
Dynamic backlight: Standart
MPEG art. red.: Medium
Colour enhancement: off
Gamma: 0
Video contrast: 84
Light sensor: Off
Picture format: widescreen
edges : 4

Smart Picture: ISF Nigth
Backlight contrast: 40
Brightness: 40
Color: 32
Sharpness: 3
Noise red.: medium
Tint: Custom
R Gain 117
G Gain 87
B Gain 75
R-BL: 2
G-BL: -2
B-BL: 1
PNM: Max
Clear LCD: On
Super res.: On
Perfect contrast: Minimum
Dynamic backlight: Standart
MPEG art. red.: Medium
Colour enhancement: off
Gamma: 1
Video contrast: 90
Light sensor: Off
Picture format: widescreen
edges : 4

I notice for great blacks change brightness to the minimum possible for me 40. And Dynamic backlight i change to Standart less calculations, they should by much faster so we shouldnt notice, and i put sharpness to 3 it seems it works better with PNM on. I hope Philips improve this, its acept but not good. The problem like i said is with upper layers where are subtitles and logos timers etc.
I know its dificult to get close to reality, i give a lot importance of the color and sharpness of skin,wood,metalic etc, dark scenes and fast movements. see movies. Taken with Cyber-shot of sony, the movie you will see is in blu-ray the "Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides " hope it help

Blu-Ray HD With PNM MAX

http://youtu.be/EPRM7ohKsBE

Blu-Ray HD With PNM off

http://youtu.be/U1k08HVeqHA

SD Channel Eurosport PNM = MAx

http://youtu.be/7AS_gTLsT4g

ukue
07-29-2012, 06:45 PM
Below are my 40PFL8606 settings TV:


Blu-Ray HD With PNM MAX

http://youtu.be/EPRM7ohKsBE

Blu-Ray HD With PNM off

http://youtu.be/U1k08HVeqHA

SD Channel Eurosport PNM = MAx

http://youtu.be/7AS_gTLsT4g

I see the same artifacts on my 9706 with the pnm ON . It disappears when I turn it off

CrisRoda
07-30-2012, 10:07 PM
I have made better ajustements for both HD and SD source and these are my final settings for now.
I hope Philips improve this, PNM on, maybe speed calculations, optimize subroutines..., improve and enlarge the grey scale for better image in the dark, in the dark scenes sometimes i ask what we should we see or not, its dificult. Moving objects in the action scene still gets artifacts and shadows...

Below are my current 40PFL8606 settings TV:
Smart Picture: ISF Day
Backlight contrast: 56
Brightness: 40
Color: 32
Sharpness: 3
Noise red.: Minimum
Tint: Custom
R Gain 117
G Gain 87
B Gain 75
R-BL: 2
G-BL: -2
B-BL: 1
PNM: Max
Clear LCD: On
Super res.: On
Perfect contrast: Minimum
Dynamic backlight: Standart
MPEG art. red.: Minimum
Colour enhancement: off
Gamma: 0
Video contrast: 84
Light sensor: Off
Picture format: widescreen
edges : 4

Smart Picture: ISF Nigth
Backlight contrast: 40
Brightness: 40
Color: 32
Sharpness: 3
Noise red.: Minimum
Tint: Custom
R Gain 117
G Gain 87
B Gain 75
R-BL: 2
G-BL: -2
B-BL: 1
PNM: Max
Clear LCD: On
Super res.: On
Perfect contrast: Minimum
Dynamic backlight: Standart
MPEG art. red.: Minimum
Colour enhancement: off
Gamma: 1
Video contrast: 90
Light sensor: Off
Picture format: widescreen
edges : 4

cemeli
07-31-2012, 12:11 AM
Is there a good settings for 9706
thanks

buyukbang
07-31-2012, 06:18 AM
My experience with ..99 is like below:

I watched "the Raven" last night, a movie with lots of dark scenes, I noticed adjusting process of local dimming is more noticeable than 0.98. For example, on a dark scene, the actor makes very slow movements where he sat down (fixed place), but even with these slow movements dimming of the darkness of the room was changing (being adjusted) continuously, which gives wrong and distracting picture drawings.

However I cannot confirm "the grey" issue, I checked black bars on 4:3 content, on my STB menu, etc. They all had strong and beautiful blacks as before. ( I'm using Using Cinema Mode with Local Dimming set as Standart without any other modification)

But I'm still not happy with the distracting (imho, buggy implementation) dimming adjustment. I'll switch back to previous firmware and test this movie again.

BTW, I'm not interested with PNM improvements: I always use TV as PNM deactivated since I don't like what it does on the picture.

@zlatko,
I'm also waiting for your 0.98 upload, I'll switch back to previous firmware. Thanks !


I can confirm the problems mentioned by Toengel with my 9956 using activated dynamic backlight settings and activated perfect contrast.

Moreover and worst: it seems to me that the "moving artefacts", which I almost only knew from the 9955 up to today, now are also appearing much more often and painfully more visible on the 9956.



"moving backlight artefacts", I think this is the right term for what I want to express in my previous report here in previous page (http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?6621-Your-experiences-with-FW-v0-14-99-0-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-(2011-models)&p=37221&viewfull=1#post37221). Yes, this was very bad and very distracting in 0.99 and I downgraded mainly because of that issue.

@Philips, please roll back what you did for Local Dimming logic in 0.99 and preserve other fixes in the next firmware built.


Now I found another problem that causes Dynamic Backlighting works wrong. See the following link, I can confirm that this issue exists on my 52PFL9606 with both 0.98 and 0.99 firmwares.


http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?1265-Dimming-problem-every-time-subtitles-appear-on-32PFL9705


SubtitleDimming.mpg (its download link is given on the first post of the above thread) is a good example that clearly shows the problem. I also confirmed same issue with several bluray and mkv movies with dark scenes. All gives the same result. When subtitles are shown a total (mean covers all the screen area) dimming increase occurs, when the subtitle disappears, all the screen becomes darker. If you think that subtitles are shown/disappears with a high frequency, this makes really annoying everything even you cannot watch the movie, you can find yourself just looking at this strange and dummy screen backligting fluctuation like fireworks !!!

I tested both "Best Picture Quallity" and "Standart" settings, they give the same result.

@Toengel & @Zlatko,
Could you please test and confirm the issue with the latest firmware.

@Philips,
This problem really causes a very bad user experience since I always watch movies with subtitles. Only turning off Dynamic Backlight option solves this issue. But hey, I give too much buck for an High End TV with local dimming! Please fix this in the next release.

Regards...

zlatko
07-31-2012, 06:31 AM
@buyukbang
I will test and share my observations here.
I am watching HD movies with subtitles very often and so far I haven't noticed such an issue. When I upgraded to 14.99 at first I noticed the TV lightens up a whole band/stripe edge to edge on the screen under subtitles. Now that I have dramatically lowered my backlight and brightness settings due to changes in dimming logic in 14.99 I do not notice this when watching normally, straight ahead of the screen. But I really need to do some tests when I have time to fiddle with this, to give you my opinion.

buyukbang
07-31-2012, 06:40 AM
@zlatko,

I also never noticed this issue till now. Now after discovering this issue, I can see it on all dark scenes:(

I'm using Cinema Mod with Dinamic Backlight option is set to Standart without ohter modifications. So my brigtheness, contrast and backlight settings are pretty low in the Cinema mod. Unfortunately, I think no setting can fix this issue.

I'm waiting your feedback mate.

zlatko
08-02-2012, 09:09 PM
@buyukbang
I have tried several times to see the issue with subtitles on dark content. I can not tell I notice any distracting artefacts. Watched like 10min. of Harry Potter 3 - looks very good. Watched the clip from "Entrapment" that Freddy had posted in the original thread about the issue - still looks good to me. During the weekend I will download and test the other clips. This Olympic games take most of my time infront TV, so not much time for tests :)

PS. My settings are with contrast at 50 and brightness to 52 since 14.99. Dynamic backlight to Standard.

buyukbang
08-03-2012, 07:37 AM
Thanks for the test ! To be honest, I'm really surprised with your feedback, I was pretty sure that you'll confirm the issue since we both have 52PFL9606. The clip that Freddy had posted in the first message of the the thread show the issue very clearly to me.

I'll try your settings you give in the below link with your latest modifications (contrast:50 brightness:52) included, then post the result here:





@buyukbang
I have tried several times to see the issue with subtitles on dark content. I can not tell I notice any distracting artefacts. Watched like 10min. of Harry Potter 3 - looks very good. Watched the clip from "Entrapment" that Freddy had posted in the original thread about the issue - still looks good to me. During the weekend I will download and test the other clips. This Olympic games take most of my time infront TV, so not much time for tests :)

PS. My settings are with contrast at 50 and brightness to 52 since 14.99. Dynamic backlight to Standard.

zlatko
08-03-2012, 08:46 AM
@buyukbang
To be honest I am surprised as well :) Following your, Toengel's, Freddy's, petasis'(sorry if I missed smbdy) posts in these forums I know I can trust you guys with your judgement what is perceived as good PQ. So I was pretty sure I will notice subtitle issue.
I switched off Ambi and was watching in completely dark room during the night - still no distracting artefacts or issues in overall screen brightness when subtitles are on screen and when not.
When I go near the screen and watch from a side - angle is like 15-25 degrees - I can see some changes and distinguish dynamic backlight operation.
Let me know your observations with Contrast&Brightness around 50 and Gamma at 2. My perfect contrast is at medium.

buyukbang
08-04-2012, 12:27 PM
With same setting you shared here (http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?6621-Your-experiences-with-FW-v0-14-99-0-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-(2011-models)&p=36997&viewfull=1#post36997) and contrast:50 brightness:52 modifications as you suggested I got the same sad result as seen on my own video record given below. I only turned off Perfect Contrast. You can see how bad local dimming works with subtitles :(

http://www.sendspace.com/file/zujam5

I can clearly say after my tests:
- No single picture/advanced video setting can fix that except turning off dynamic backlight or turning on (minumum, medium or maximum, all settings are OK except off) Perfect Contrast.
- I can perfectly see this problem from every angle, so not related with that.
- You can see that problem in a dark room, but as you can see in my video record, it's still very clear in day light.
- You can see that problem in a dark scene, but I can now easily see backlight changes caused by subtitles in bright scenes.

This is clearly a problem of local dimming algorithm with Perfect Contrast disabled, so I think it's possible to fix by a firmware upgrade.

I recorded this video in 1080p high quality format (250 mb) but because of the big file size, I shared the link of downsized (8mb) version. If Philips changes wants to fix this issue I can provide high quality video record file to inspect it better.


@buyukbang
To be honest I am surprised as well :) Following your, Toengel's, Freddy's, petasis'(sorry if I missed smbdy) posts in these forums I know I can trust you guys with your judgement what is perceived as good PQ. So I was pretty sure I will notice subtitle issue.
I switched off Ambi and was watching in completely dark room during the night - still no distracting artefacts or issues in overall screen brightness when subtitles are on screen and when not.
When I go near the screen and watch from a side - angle is like 15-25 degrees - I can see some changes and distinguish dynamic backlight operation.
Let me know your observations with Contrast&Brightness around 50 and Gamma at 2. My perfect contrast is at medium.

kookaburra
08-04-2012, 12:57 PM
My TV is 21:9 58pfl9956. I can not reproduce this failure of the subtitles. Works fine. I have some single point failure in some very dark images.

google translator

buyukbang
08-04-2012, 01:51 PM
I just found that the problem is caused only when turning off "Perfect Contrast" . I just set it to medium and everyhing is OK now :)

But I still think that this is a bug since I don't like any image processing mechanisms when watching bluray (OK when it comes to TV) and I just want to see this type contents as they are provided. So I've been always turned off PNM, Perfect Contrast, etc. But now I have to turn on "Perfect Contrast".

Final summary of the whole story:
Perfect Contrast Disabled + Dynamic Backlight Enabled = Subtitle Dimming Artefact


With same setting you shared here (http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?6621-Your-experiences-with-FW-v0-14-99-0-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-(2011-models)&p=36997&viewfull=1#post36997) and contrast:50 brightness:52 modifications as you suggested I got the same sad result as seen on my own video record given below. I only turned off Perfect Contrast. You can see how bad local dimming works with subtitles :(

http://www.sendspace.com/file/zujam5

I can clearly say after my tests:
- No single picture/advanced video setting can fix that except turning off dynamic backlight or turning on (minumum, medium or maximum, all settings are OK except off) Perfect Contrast.
- I can perfectly see this problem from every angle, so not related with that.
- You can see that problem in a dark room, but as you can see in my video record, it's still very clear in day light.
- You can see that problem in a dark scene, but I can now easily see backlight changes caused by subtitles in bright scenes.

This is clearly a problem of local dimming algorithm with Perfect Contrast disabled, so I think it's possible to fix by a firmware upgrade.

I recorded this video in 1080p high quality format (250 mb) but because of the big file size, I shared the link of downsized (8mb) version. If Philips changes wants to fix this issue I can provide high quality video record file to inspect it better.

zlatko
08-04-2012, 01:55 PM
@buyukbang
You saved me some time of staring at the screen - I was just starting tests again, as on your video I can clearly see the subtitle issue! :)
I was wondering what is wrong with my eyes as I can not see it on my TV.
So lesson for us all - we have to state clearly ALL our picture settings when doing such tests.

EDIT: Confirmed - with Perfect Contrast OFF I can see subtitle issue even in bright daylight.

buyukbang
08-04-2012, 02:46 PM
Zlatko,

thank you very much for the confirmation !

This bug made me really feel bad about my TV during the past days. After finding a workaround fix with Perfect Contrast setting, I'm planning to enjoy again watching bluray on my TV this night, :)

BTW,
I wish we could find a solution for the DSE issue since Philips simply ignore it :(


@buyukbang
You saved me some time of staring at the screen - I was just starting tests again, as on your video I can clearly see the subtitle issue! :)
I was wondering what is wrong with my eyes as I can not see it on my TV.
So lesson for us all - we have to state clearly ALL our picture settings when doing such tests.

EDIT: Confirmed - with Perfect Contrast OFF I can see subtitle issue even in bright daylight.


kookaburra,
Sorry but as you can see from the last messages, we just find that Perfect Contrast OFF + Dynamic Backlight is ON causes the issue. You may want to recheck with these settings.


My TV is 21:9 58pfl9956. I can not reproduce this failure of the subtitles. Works fine. I have some single point failure in some very dark images.

google translator

kingzapp
08-04-2012, 10:00 PM
BTW,
I wish we could find a solution for the DSE issue since Philips simply ignore it :(


so true... I called in to philip norway for almost 3 weeks ago and they said they will call me up for picking my tv up for dse checking but never did :( hope they will change the panel and hope the new panel will be much better. The DSE is kinda killing SD sending and Bluray movie :mad:

zlatko
08-04-2012, 10:24 PM
@buyukbang
About DSE Philips basically said it is normal to be there. It is sad, but we can not do anything. It is manufacturing/engineering defect. Can not be corrected with SW changes.

@kingzapp
There is slight chance that DSE on your new panel will be less noticeable. But don't hold your breath ;)

Espen000
08-05-2012, 08:17 AM
Hello Philips.

First of all I would like to thank you for the FW update to improve the local dimming issue. I tested some movies now and I can see there picture quality has improved.

But it is still not perfect. For the first time in a long time I invited some friends over last night to watch a movie hoping to enjoy my "new" TV. We decided to watch "The Grey". Unfortunately during the movie my friends started asking "what happened now?" and "what is wrong with the picture. I had to turn off the local dimming for the remaining of the movie losing the great black levels.. :(

So today I uploaded two scenes from the movies I checked the last few days showing that it is still not working. Could you look into this and see if you are able to replicate the issue in you lab?

PS! Sorry for the extreme reflection in the screen during these vidoes. They were taken in the morning when the sun was shining directly into my living room. You can even clearly see my artwork on the wall!! :cool:



The Grey - Especially notice from 01.06 min:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmidIYaLnns&feature=youtu.be



Casino Royale
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8aJHdBIVxPI&feature=youtu.be

CrisRoda
08-05-2012, 09:13 AM
@buyukbang
You saved me some time of staring at the screen - I was just starting tests again, as on your video I can clearly see the subtitle issue! :)
I was wondering what is wrong with my eyes as I can not see it on my TV.
So lesson for us all - we have to state clearly ALL our picture settings when doing such tests.

EDIT: Confirmed - with Perfect Contrast OFF I can see subtitle issue even in bright daylight.

HI zlatko and everyone, yes this happens to me to 40pfl8606, and this is worst if you see in SD source and whith PNM on, there is a relation on all the settings, even whit Sharpness option if you increase you will see it better, so Perfect Contrast Disabled + Dynamic Backlight Enabled + PNM on + Sharp > 3 = Subtitle Dimming Artefact

ali54
08-05-2012, 09:14 AM
Hello Philips.

First of all I would like to thank you for the FW update to improve the local dimming issue. I tested some movies now and I can see there picture quality has improved.

But it is still not perfect. For the first time in a long time I invited some friends over last night to watch a movie hoping to enjoy my "new" TV. We decided to watch "The Grey". Unfortunately during the movie my friends started asking "what happened now?" and "what is wrong with the picture. I had to turn off the local dimming for the remaining of the movie losing the great black levels.. :(

So today I uploaded two scenes from the movies I checked the last few days showing that it is still not working. Could you look into this and see if you are able to replicate the issue in you lab?

PS! Sorry for the extreme reflection in the screen during these vidoes. They were taken in the morning when the sun was shining directly into my living room. You can even clearly see my artwork on the wall!! :cool:



The Grey - Especially notice from 01.06 min:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmidIYaLnns&feature=youtu.be



Casino Royale
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8aJHdBIVxPI&feature=youtu.be

the part showing from casino royale.i seen that from day one on 9705 wich it has been two years now and over 20 updates and no fix i dont think there will be a fix for that aver

buyukbang
08-05-2012, 12:58 PM
I can confirm your findings. Yesterday I lowered my "Video Contrast" setting from 100 to 90 and saw "Subtitle Dimming Artefact". So here is another valid formula :

Perfect Contrast Enabled + Dynamic Backlight Enabled + "Video Contrast" <= 90 = Subtitle Dimming Artefact

However, I'm happy with my current settings, I see zero Subtitle Dimming Artefact at the moment. For anyone interested, I'm using default Cinema Mod with "only" below modifications. If you want to try this setting, do not forget to reset it before setting below values:

Dynamic Backlight = Standart (instead of default Off)
Clear LCD: On (instead of default Off)
Perfect contrast: Minimum (instead of default Off)
Video Contrast" = 100 (instead of default 90)
Light sensor: On (instead of default Off)

This seems as the best setting for the very high quality contents like bluray or HD channels with high bitrate (like SKY Italy).


BTW,
My other findings are below. I just tested in 0.99 firmware, but I think these are not related with this specific firmware version and will be valid for all future firmwares due to the nature of their image processing algorithms:

PNM: Causes motion artefects, I can see them in all scenes with fast actions. These artefects are really annoying things. For example, I can see an absurd black rectangle in the picture where it should never be :) Calculating /predicting/drawing inter-images is just a very very difficult thing. I cannot blame Philips for that. Actually I don't have any expectation about that, I just want to watch what the source have.

MPEG artifact reduction: Causes lose of picture details and sharpness. You can simply test this with the same video we discussed in the previous page to test Subtitle Dimming Artefacts problem. Just start playback then activate/deactivate this setting to see the difference. Losing picture details simply is not my cup of tea :/ But of course you may like it. I strongly suggest you to test this to have an idea about what this setting actually does.


HI zlatko and everyone, yes this happens to me to 40pfl8606, and this is worst if you see in SD source and whith PNM on, there is a relation on all the settings, even whit Sharpness option if you increase you will see it better, so Perfect Contrast Disabled + Dynamic Backlight Enabled + PNM on + Sharp > 3 = Subtitle Dimming Artefact

buyukbang
08-06-2012, 06:27 AM
Hi Espen000,

Could you please try my modified Cinema Mod settings given above. I think this issue is very similar what I've experienced before. If you check my video on the previous page, you can see both this issue (in the scenes without subtitle) and the Subtitle Dimming Artifact issue. All solved after applying my new settings.

If the issue is not solved even after applying my settings, I would like to test this video if you could cut one minute part from the movie file and upload it for us.


Hello Philips.

First of all I would like to thank you for the FW update to improve the local dimming issue. I tested some movies now and I can see there picture quality has improved.

But it is still not perfect. For the first time in a long time I invited some friends over last night to watch a movie hoping to enjoy my "new" TV. We decided to watch "The Grey". Unfortunately during the movie my friends started asking "what happened now?" and "what is wrong with the picture. I had to turn off the local dimming for the remaining of the movie losing the great black levels.. :(

So today I uploaded two scenes from the movies I checked the last few days showing that it is still not working. Could you look into this and see if you are able to replicate the issue in you lab?

PS! Sorry for the extreme reflection in the screen during these vidoes. They were taken in the morning when the sun was shining directly into my living room. You can even clearly see my artwork on the wall!! :cool:

Toengel
08-06-2012, 06:31 AM
Hi,

my experience of two week 14:99

(already posted) local dimming problem in black bars
(already posted) no HbbTV on German ZDF channels
(already posted) missing images in NetTV (e.g. Spiegel App and Recommondations Panel)
(new observed) IP-EPG detail pages are empty (black)
(new observed) TV switched off after 2 hours
(new observed) TV was on in the morning, but display was off


Lot thinks to do...

Toengel@Alex

jgl
08-06-2012, 07:36 AM
Hi all, in respect to my PFL8606H and 14.99 the only issue I have detected is with HbbTV:

- HbbTV avaiable menu appears ok
- Pressing the red key to enter the HbbTV shows the HbbTV menu one second, then it suddenly disappears
- If you try to enter again to HbbTV the regular menu for that key is shown instead of the HbbTV menu

So is not possible anymore to use HbbTV feature.

bluevoice
08-06-2012, 08:26 AM
Hi all,

First of all, Philips, thanks for solving the PNM bug. This was one of the most annoying bugs on my TV. It took you just 8 months to solve it, but you did it!

With the 14.99 software I still notice 2 major issues:

1) TV reboots cased by Philips HTS incompatibility when using Easylink, documented 10 month ago in: http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?3762-PHILIPS-PLEASE-HELP-HTS8562-12-crashing-Philips-Cinema-Gold-TV-(50PFL7956H-12)/page4. Philips's high end products are still incompatible with each other.
2) TV does not remember preset screen ratio format for a certain profile. You will notice that the screen format changes when you go to different menu items on a Philips HTS. Mostly it will go to the top most option called "Auto-fill". The preset screen ratio should be consistent on every input source (i.e. HDMI1).

mduran
08-06-2012, 08:41 AM
@bluevoice,

Don't forget the sounddrops on AC3 channels. The sound drops a few times a night when watching Dutch channels with AC3 audiostream.

Okuden
08-06-2012, 02:42 PM
Hi,

since the latest firmware 14.99, blacks turned grey. After a few seconds the picture returns to normal.
TV is very slow to react to the brigthness of the picture.

The problem will be fixed for the next firmware ?

Or downgrade is possible ?

Best regards.


Google traduction

CrisRoda
08-06-2012, 10:53 PM
I have some ajustements for both HD and SD source, and games that a lot of dark scenes, and i notice that my last settings, removed a lot of grey, the grey almost vanish, the black obsorved it. its very dificult to get the perfect image in all situations, and sources,even in sd channels the emissions have diferentes settings. i have tested what buyukbang said its not bad, but the grey,even the color is not very good combinations its hard,sometimes people get to yellow ohter to red, i try to combine everything.
I hope Philips improve all the calculations, optimize subroutines, combination of blacks but keep the grey, do not turn grey into black, and shadows of moving objects. the subtitles thing you notice
them when they are up on moving things, you Philips can create animation movie and put background grey, better a pattern grey scale whit subtittles in white, with a moving line in black moving around the subtitles and see what happens. Only want to help improve. I like Philips, but i want the best.

Below are my current 40PFL8606 settings TV:

Smart Picture: Personal
Backlight contrast: 45
Brightness: 50
Color: 36
Sharpness: 2
Noise red.: off
Tint: Custom
R Gain 117
G Gain 97
B Gain 81
R-BL: 1
G-BL: -1
B-BL: -4
PNM: Medium
Clear LCD: On
Super res.: On
Perfect contrast: off
Dynamic backlight: off
MPEG art. red.: Minimum
Colour enhancement: off
Gamma: 0
Video contrast: 82
Light sensor: Off
Picture format: widescreen
edges : 4

Espen000
08-07-2012, 08:17 AM
I tried with your cinema settings. It was a little bit better in regards to the local dimming artefacts. But setting the Video contrast to 100 the pricture on light scenes became too bright in my opinion.. :cool:


I can confirm your findings. Yesterday I lowered my "Video Contrast" setting from 100 to 90 and saw "Subtitle Dimming Artefact". So here is another valid formula :

Perfect Contrast Enabled + Dynamic Backlight Enabled + "Video Contrast" <= 90 = Subtitle Dimming Artefact

However, I'm happy with my current settings, I see zero Subtitle Dimming Artefact at the moment. For anyone interested, I'm using default Cinema Mod with "only" below modifications. If you want to try this setting, do not forget to reset it before setting below values:

Dynamic Backlight = Standart (instead of default Off)
Clear LCD: On (instead of default Off)
Perfect contrast: Minimum (instead of default Off)
Video Contrast" = 100 (instead of default 90)
Light sensor: On (instead of default Off)

This seems as the best setting for the very high quality contents like bluray or HD channels with high bitrate (like SKY Italy).


BTW,
My other findings are below. I just tested in 0.99 firmware, but I think these are not related with this specific firmware version and will be valid for all future firmwares due to the nature of their image processing algorithms:

PNM: Causes motion artefects, I can see them in all scenes with fast actions. These artefects are really annoying things. For example, I can see an absurd black rectangle in the picture where it should never be :) Calculating /predicting/drawing inter-images is just a very very difficult thing. I cannot blame Philips for that. Actually I don't have any expectation about that, I just want to watch what the source have.

MPEG artifact reduction: Causes lose of picture details and sharpness. You can simply test this with the same video we discussed in the previous page to test Subtitle Dimming Artefacts problem. Just start playback then activate/deactivate this setting to see the difference. Losing picture details simply is not my cup of tea :/ But of course you may like it. I strongly suggest you to test this to have an idea about what this setting actually does.

Bert
08-07-2012, 11:03 AM
I have some ajustements for both HD and SD source, and games that a lot of dark scenes, and i notice that my last settings, removed a lot of grey, the grey almost vanish, the black obsorved it. its very dificult to get the perfect image in all situations, and sources,even in sd channels the emissions have diferentes settings. i have tested what buyukbang said its not bad, but the grey,even the color is not very good combinations its hard,sometimes people get to yellow ohter to red, i try to combine everything.
I hope Philips improve all the calculations, optimize subroutines, combination of blacks but keep the grey, do not turn grey into black, and shadows of moving objects. the subtitles thing you notice
them when they are up on moving things, you Philips can create animation movie and put background grey, better a pattern grey scale whit subtittles in white, with a moving line in black moving around the subtitles and see what happens. Only want to help improve. I like Philips, but i want the best.

Below are my current 40PFL8606 settings TV:

Smart Picture: Personal
Backlight contrast: 45
Brightness: 50
Color: 36
Sharpness: 2
Noise red.: off
Tint: Custom
R Gain 117
G Gain 97
B Gain 81
R-BL: 1
G-BL: -1
B-BL: -4
PNM: Medium
Clear LCD: On
Super res.: On
Perfect contrast: off
Dynamic backlight: off
MPEG art. red.: Minimum
Colour enhancement: off
Gamma: 0
Video contrast: 82
Light sensor: Off
Picture format: widescreen
edges : 4


These are my perfect settings for my 46PFL8606:

ISF DAY adjustment:
Backlight contrast: 60
Brightness: 48
Color: 50
Sharpness: 2
Noise red.: Off
Tint: custom: 127/97/64/0/-1/0
PNM: Off
Clear LCD: On
Super res.: On
Perfect contrast: Minimum
Dynamic backlight: Best picture
MPEG art. red.: Off
Colour enhancement: Minimum
Gamma: 0
Video contrast: 84
ISF menu: 2nd in the list => HDMI-PC level brightness: 'Off' (=standard selected in ISF settings)
Light sensor: Off
Picture format: widescreen
edges: 10

These settings can maybe also be related to the blu-ray player you use to watch movies, I have a Panasonic blu-ray player DMP-BDT500.
These settings satisfy me for all sources, both HD and SD, when I watch TV in a dark room. In a not darkened room these settings remain very good.

Regards

bluevoice
08-10-2012, 08:54 AM
Hi guys,

On the download page of my TV I see the firmware files from 17 July have been replaced by new ones yesterday 9 August:


58pfl9956h_12_fus_eng.zip (http://68.166.223.4/58pfl9956h_12_fus_eng.zip) 17-Jul-2012 13:01 76M
58pfl9956h_12_fus_eng.zip (http://68.166.223.4/58pfl9956h_12_fus_eng.zip) 09-Aug-2012 11:01 77M

However when I download the file this is still the 14.99 firmware. Is there a new firmware out there, or a new build of 14.99? Maybe Philips could give us an explanation.

zlatko
08-10-2012, 08:57 AM
@bluevoice
Same for my 9606 - expected as they share same SW image with 9956. It will be good if somebody from Philips pours some light on this. I am at work now, otherwise I would have tried if updating will work.

Toengel
08-10-2012, 09:00 AM
Hi,

in the old ZIP archive the PDF file was corrupt - now it has been fixed. Firmware wasn't changed.

Toengel@Alex

bluevoice
08-10-2012, 09:35 AM
@bluevoice
Same for my 9606 - expected as they share same SW image with 9956. It will be good if somebody from Philips pours some light on this. I am at work now, otherwise I would have tried if updating will work.

Updating should always work if you do it from the local updates option, I wonder if the TV would recognize the new file automaticly and start the upgrading process.

It would be interesting to know if the new autorun.upg file is different from the one uploaded on 17 July. The "new" file has creation date: ‎11 ‎juli ‎2012, ‏‎16:53:12.

zlatko
08-10-2012, 09:38 AM
@bluevoice
As Toengel explained above - only .pdf file was replaced in the .zip archive. No changes in SW image.

bluevoice
08-10-2012, 09:45 AM
Hi,

in the old ZIP archive the PDF file was corrupt - now it has been fixed. Firmware wasn't changed.

Toengel@Alex

Thanks! One more question Alex, how or where can you read the generation date of the software you always mention on your blog?

Q5553-0.14.99.0_bld78a Generation date: 11/07/2012 00:20:27


@bluevoice
As Toengel explained above - only .pdf file was replaced in the .zip archive. No changes in SW image.

False alarm then, I'm secretly still hoping that the Easylink reboot issue with high end Philips HTS devices will get solved one day...

bluevoice
08-13-2012, 04:17 PM
Hi,


I posted the settings have been calibrated by myself @ D65 Rec709 :)

DT-94 colorimeter, AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray, Panasonic DMP-BDT110 @HDMI 1080p

Link settings: http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?6621-Your-experiences-with-FW-v0-14-99-0-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-%282011-models%29&p=36995&viewfull=1#post36995.

Kolorimeter DT-94, AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray, Panasonic DMP-BDT110 @HDMI @1080p

Here, the measurement protocols for example for isf night...

http://www.abload.de/thumb/philips21_93pd23.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=philips21_93pd23.jpg)


Black is black with Firmware 14.99 @my 21:9 platinum.


regards

Google translation

@ intothehouse: I have a question on a personal, more or less taste matter.

I also had my 58PFL9958H/12 ISF calibrated and the settings are more or less the same as yours. However I'm a little troubled because in the computer I see those perfect curves and all seems to be perfect but in my eyes the colors do not look right. When I look at the screen the white is not white but rather yellowish. And white should be white after calibration, right? There's an overall warm tint I personally don't like.

So I calibrated the tv using my eyes and some Blurays and these are my own settings this moment and the white is white and I personally like the colors better this way.

Backlight contrast: 80
Brightness: 46
Color: 50
Sharpness: 2
Noise reduction: off
Tint: Custom
Custom tint: 50, 43, 46, 0, 0, 0
Pixel Perfect HD:
PNM: Off
Clear LCD: On
Super resolution: Off
Perfect contrast: Medium
Dynamic backlight: Standard
MPEG artifact reduction: Off
Colour enhancement: Off
Gamma: -2
Video contrast: 85
Light sensor: On
Screen edges: 0

I wonder if anyone has the same tint settings, or could try my tint settings and tell me about the results in color quality. Your reply would be kindly appreciated.

inthehouse
08-14-2012, 07:51 AM
Hi bluevoice, :)

a calibrated D65 image looks a little warmer in the primal moment from the first moment, because it was used well / is too cool image (too blue) with the
Presets Normal, look, etc.

The estimation of white is especially difficult. One tends rapidly to white as possible "to turn pale." At 6500K white does right, but not glaring and pale, but rather warm, like an eggshell. Remember: White is in the video presentation of the midday sun in its corresponding color.

Please see the pictures

"Normal"
http://www.abload.de/thumb/normal1kajk.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=normal1kajk.jpg)

"D-65"
http://www.abload.de/thumb/d65mgagr.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=d65mgagr.jpg)

The D65 image is standard, and measurements correctly.

Proper D-65 calibration with the "eyes" is not possible, and the personal taste again, but not the norm. This can only be measured with technical equipment.

But it does not please everyone (D-65), please dont forget this point.

regards
Goggle translation

bluevoice
08-14-2012, 08:03 AM
Hi bluevoice, :)

a calibrated D65 image looks a little warmer in the primal moment from the first moment, because it was used well / is too cool image (too blue) with the
Presets Normal, look, etc.

Please see the pictures

"Normal"
http://www.abload.de/thumb/normal1kajk.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=normal1kajk.jpg)

"D-65"
http://www.abload.de/thumb/d65mgagr.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=d65mgagr.jpg)

The D65 image is standard, and measurements correctly.

But it does not please everyone, please dont forget this point.

regards
Goggle translation

Hi @inthehouse. Thank you! Your example shows exactly what I mean and what I'm seeing.

I know this is a matter of personal taste and for me the "normal" image looks better because from my point of view the colors are closer to what you see in real life. But maybe I'm used to a much bluer, cooler image.

stefanox
08-14-2012, 06:01 PM
hey guys,

is there any news about the new range tv from philips.
saw some photo's from the 46PFL9707, is this true?
if yes, when they release this new models?

stef

Toengel
08-14-2012, 06:08 PM
Hi,

I think 9000 series will be announced at the IFA in Berlin end of August. The other 2012 series are already available. You can find much information in my blog: 58PFL9955.wordpress.com (see right column).

Toengel@Alex

mduran
08-15-2012, 09:04 AM
What I noticed don't know if previous firmware had this issue also.

Problem description:

If I enable PNM and Clear LCD and watching a HD channel the following occurs: If the scene changes and the first few frames are panning shots or so. The first seconds of this scene are dropped or there is a judder visible, after that the screen turns normal. It looks like PNM needs a second or 2 to see there is movement and starts to work after. So watching a movie with a lot of scene changes are unwatchable because of this.

Problem2:

The autofill and autozoom functions are not working until you change input from HDMI2 to HDMI1 again. After this it works again.

bluevoice
08-15-2012, 09:10 AM
What I noticed don't know if previous firmware had this issue also.

Problem2:

The autofill and autozoom functions are not working until you change input from HDMI2 to HDMI1 again. After this it works again.


Hi all,

First of all, Philips, thanks for solving the PNM bug. This was one of the most annoying bugs on my TV. It took you just 8 months to solve it, but you did it!

With the 14.99 software I still notice 2 major issues:

1) TV reboots cased by Philips HTS incompatibility when using Easylink, documented 10 month ago in: http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?3762-PHILIPS-PLEASE-HELP-HTS8562-12-crashing-Philips-Cinema-Gold-TV-(50PFL7956H-12)/page4. Philips's high end products are still incompatible with each other.
2) TV does not remember preset screen ratio format for a certain profile. You will notice that the screen format changes when you go to different menu items on a Philips HTS. Mostly it will go to the top most option called "Auto-fill". The preset screen ratio should be consistent on every input source (i.e. HDMI1).

More or less the same as my problem #2 in my previous post: #113 (http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?6621-Your-experiences-with-FW-v0-14-99-0-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-(2011-models)&p=38098&viewfull=1#post38098)

buyukbang
08-15-2012, 10:04 PM
Second this comment.

For example hair color of the lady in the bottom left picture seems brown in "D-65" but it's black in "Normal" which seems true.



Hi @inthehouse. Thank you! Your example shows exactly what I mean and what I'm seeing.

I know this is a matter of personal taste and for me the "normal" image looks better because from my point of view the colors are closer to what you see in real life. But maybe I'm used to a much bluer, cooler image.

CrisRoda
08-20-2012, 10:18 PM
Hi i notice a strange situation, i in Portugal and i have a channel that is off emission now (RTP Olimpicos HD) , and have an still image, with a golden cup, and i notice that PHILIPS 40pfl8606 is always calculating, getting blur and then sharp, this should not happen whith a still image. Another thing when the emission is 4:3 we get the black bars and when i change channels with my satellite box, that have a bottom bar in grey, the grey is not constante in the side ends, the grey is more white i can say is with, both sides left and right, the grey bar have diferente tones and should be equal all around, the i pay more atencion and even in 16:9 source have the same problem in the side ends the colors tend to white. Get back wiht the still imagem like fotos, when the image is displayed, there should be now more calculations, the pixels are the same there is now change. I dont now how this works but the pixels are not controled independently, on or off,why are this problems, no change no light, its better to remove this lightening in the side ends is anoying, or rework then decrease intensity is not constant, you even test to turn the tv wiht no source on, just black screen and see that the black is not the same around the display.

erje
08-22-2012, 06:59 PM
Hi,

my experience of two week 14:99

(already posted) local dimming problem in black bars
(already posted) no HbbTV on German ZDF channels
(already posted) missing images in NetTV (e.g. Spiegel App and Recommondations Panel)
(new observed) IP-EPG detail pages are empty (black)
(new observed) TV switched off after 2 hours
(new observed) TV was on in the morning, but display was off


Lot thinks to do...

Toengel@Alex

I see you have got the 2 hour bug also. I have the 46PFL9706T/12 and have experienced the bug with all recent firmwares. Now running the 14.99. I have a friend with the same TV and he have the same bug, which I have named the 2 hour bug as the TV switches off without any message after 2 hours (to the minute). All this after a long standby period. When using the power switch on the side the problem seem to go away (my friend have a different opinion). Anyway the standby mode is useless with this bug. Is Philips addressing this???:confused:

abuelzouz
08-23-2012, 07:23 AM
what happens if i didn't do a cold reboot, as i updated the tv without reading the article, is it wrong?
do i need to do something?

zlatko
08-23-2012, 09:27 AM
@abuelzouz
Don't worry, that is not a problem. You can pull out mains cable anytime. So far nobody from Philips gave us the reason for cold rebooting need in recent FW images.

abuelzouz
08-23-2012, 11:01 AM
Thanks

RieS
08-24-2012, 05:51 PM
Hi,

I have the 40PFL8606H/12.
After upgrading to FW 14.99 I hear a lot more cracking over the speakers. Never really noticed it before but since this update is installed, I hear it quite often.

This happens with (HD) tv via a settop box but also when playing a movie or dvd from my media player with the sound through my tv.


Haven't looked much at the difference in image quality as I'm still not quite sure what the optimal settings are so can't really comment on that.

BjornRuud
08-25-2012, 03:20 PM
I have the 40PFL8606H/12.
After upgrading to FW 14.99 I hear a lot more cracking over the speakers. Never really noticed it before but since this update is installed, I hear it quite often.

This happens with (HD) tv via a settop box but also when playing a movie or dvd from my media player with the sound through my tv.
It's not just me then. I too have audio crackling on my 46PFL9706. I have reported this issue on every firmware since january but it has never been acknowledged.

My audio/video sources are a BluRay player, a Boxee Box and a Xbox 360. All are connected with HDMI and configured to output regular stereo audio (PCM). Optical out on the TV is connected to DAC and then amplifier. I had the exact same setup with a Samsung TV (even same cables) before the Philips and that worked fine. The crackling is rare, at most once every hour or so, and it happens with all sources. It seems to happen slightly more often with the Xbox but that's difficult to verify.

MilkyOne
08-27-2012, 09:48 AM
It's not just me then. I too have audio crackling on my 46PFL9706. I have reported this issue on every firmware since january but it has never been acknowledged.

My audio/video sources are a BluRay player, a Boxee Box and a Xbox 360. All are connected with HDMI and configured to output regular stereo audio (PCM). Optical out on the TV is connected to DAC and then amplifier. I had the exact same setup with a Samsung TV (even same cables) before the Philips and that worked fine. The crackling is rare, at most once every hour or so, and it happens with all sources. It seems to happen slightly more often with the Xbox but that's difficult to verify.

I'm also experiencing the cracking sound more often when watching TV thru a settop box connected thru HDMI and also when using asus o!play also thru HDMI.

I had experiencied the the cracking sound in previous firmwares, on 14.99 it happens more often and the only way to stop it is once it starts happening, put the tv in standby and power it on again, and for some hours it stops. My tv is 46pfl9706h.

Espen000
08-29-2012, 07:03 AM
Hi

sure i can comment.
We do have users here reporting that local Dimming is working fine for them, we have users reporting that it has been much improved, which was the reason for us to make the changes.
Now we also have users, reporting to us that it was better before.

I saw some Photos from Toengel already and asked him for some more Details.
Thats the same i can ask all other who are complaining about the Black or local Dimming.
Share Photos and Picture Settings.

Regards
Thomas

Hello Thomas,

Would it be possible for you to comment on further development on the FW of this TV? Since the developers managed to improve the local dimming issue, does that mean they now know where the problem is and are able to improve it further?

In my post earlier in this thread I showed how my screen still have some issues though it is better. But my question is; is the delopers satisfied as it is or are they still looking to improve?
My last post:
http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?6621-Your-experiences-with-FW-v0-14-99-0-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-(2011-models)&p=38039&viewfull=1#post38039


and BTW: Too bad Philips will discontinue the 21:9 series. Really really bad news. I was exited to see what would be the next step for this model during IFA 2012..

bluevoice
08-29-2012, 01:41 PM
and BTW: Too bad Philips will discontinue the 21:9 series. Really really bad news. I was exited to see what would be the next step for this model during IFA 2012..

Philips seems still interested in our (members of the forum) opinion about their decision regarding stopping making 21:9 TV's. For this purpose I'd created a poll:

http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?7500-Philips-don-t-stop-making-21-9-TV-s

Can all 21:9 fans please vote and maybe we can do anything about this decision after all!

Espen000
08-30-2012, 06:53 AM
Philips seems still interested in our (members of the forum) opinion about their decision regarding stopping making 21:9 TV's. For this purpose I'd created a poll:

http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?7500-Philips-don-t-stop-making-21-9-TV-s

Can all 21:9 fans please vote and maybe we can do anything about this decision after all!

*done*

hardsoft
08-30-2012, 07:47 PM
Can all 21:9 fans please vote and maybe we can do anything about this decision after all!

Unfortunately the decison is/was made by the markets as the 21:9 aspect ratio was too odd and expensive for average consumer. Lucyly I bought 58PFL9956/T12 two months ago - hope it works ok years and also that Philips still continues to improve its firmware. Best set for movie fan like me :)

bluevoice
08-31-2012, 06:33 AM
Unfortunately the decison is/was made by the markets as the 21:9 aspect ratio was too odd and expensive for average consumer. Lucyly I bought 58PFL9956/T12 two months ago - hope it works ok years and also that Philips still continues to improve its firmware. Best set for movie fan like me :)

I agree on the expensive part, however I think the Philips Cinema Gold 21:9 was quite affordable. The new Cinema Gold TV would've also been affordable. I'd rather buy a 50 inch 21:9 Philips Cinema Gold TV than a 46 inch 16:9 LG TV. The price point should've been chosen to be more or less the same to be interesting for the masses.

@hardsoft: Could you please vote on the poll?

hardsoft
08-31-2012, 07:24 AM
@hardsoft: Could you please vote on the poll?

Done :)

Doengel
08-31-2012, 07:45 AM
Hi Guys,

does anybody of you know these picture artefacts and sounddrops???:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/43696112/20120824_210031.mp4

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/43696112/20120824_210922.mp4

Where do they come from? And what can i do to solve this?

Philips - Thomas
09-03-2012, 11:12 AM
Hello Thomas,

Would it be possible for you to comment on further development on the FW of this TV? Since the developers managed to improve the local dimming issue, does that mean they now know where the problem is and are able to improve it further?

In my post earlier in this thread I showed how my screen still have some issues though it is better. But my question is; is the delopers satisfied as it is or are they still looking to improve?
My last post:
http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?6621-Your-experiences-with-FW-v0-14-99-0-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-(2011-models)&p=38039&viewfull=1#post38039


and BTW: Too bad Philips will discontinue the 21:9 series. Really really bad news. I was exited to see what would be the next step for this model during IFA 2012..

Hi

sure we further improve our Products. But not only for this but for all Devices, if and when there will be a new Firmware is something noone can say.

Regards
Thomas

Eliot
09-03-2012, 03:42 PM
Thomas (or anyone else at Philips who knows the answer),

Do the different picture 'modes' (Vivid, Cinema, Games etc) actually have different built in settings? What I mean is, if I set all the setting in the menus the same for each picture mode will they all behave in the same way or are there differences inherent to each mode that I can't change, and if so what are they?

I’ve got a 46PFL9706 by the way...

Thanks,

Eliot

mduran
09-03-2012, 05:47 PM
My TV started to reboot again with 0.14.99.0 Don't know if it is the 2 hour bug or randomly. Happens every night. Picture goes blank, ambilight turns off, ambilight turns on, and picture appears again. 52pfl9606. This is not acceptable! I complained about this a few months back.

Other bugs, or is it features that no one will ever fix.

Local dimming works like sh..
Artefacts in fast moving objects,
Sharpness is always on.
TV does not know how to auto-fill the screen when turned on, have to zap back and forth to HDMI2 and HDMI1 again.
24P is not 24P but 3:2 pulldown.

And so on and so on. I payed 2800 euro for this piece of s...
Sence and simplicity???

CrisRoda
09-04-2012, 08:18 AM
My TV started to reboot again with 0.14.99.0 Don't know if it is the 2 hour bug or randomly. Happens every night. Picture goes blank, ambilight turns off, ambilight turns on, and picture appears again. 52pfl9606. This is not acceptable! I complained about this a few months back.

Other bugs, or is it features that no one will ever fix.



I but any case you dont have energy saving active, by default it is, or maybe something like that see all options.

bluevoice
09-04-2012, 08:31 AM
My TV started to reboot again with 0.14.99.0 Don't know if it is the 2 hour bug or randomly. Happens every night. Picture goes blank, ambilight turns off, ambilight turns on, and picture appears again. 52pfl9606. This is not acceptable! I complained about this a few months back.

Other bugs, or is it features that no one will ever fix.

Local dimming works like sh..
Artefacts in fast moving objects,
Sharpness is always on.
TV does not know how to auto-fill the screen when turned on, have to zap back and forth to HDMI2 and HDMI1 again.
24P is not 24P but 3:2 pulldown.

And so on and so on. I payed 2800 euro for this piece of s...
Sence and simplicity???

My Philips Cinema Platinum (58PFL9956H/12) also STILL reboots when used in combination with a Philips high-end HTS when Easylink is on. Reported this problem in October 2011, this issue is still under investigation.

@mduran: do you use a HTS or a SoundBar too?

zlatko
09-04-2012, 08:35 AM
I have never experienced reboots with my 9606. Connected to WDTV Live and Technisat Satellite receiver via HDMI and via WiFi to my home router. Can it really be some external device causing this behavior?
Anyway it is something that should not happen.

bluevoice
09-04-2012, 08:38 AM
I have never experienced reboots with my 9606. Connected to WDTV Live and Technisat Satellite receiver via HDMI and via WiFi to my home router. Can it really be some external device causing this behavior?
Anyway it is something that should not happen.

In my case it's a device incompatibility between 2 high-end Philips products caused by Easylink, see also http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?3762-PHILIPS-PLEASE-HELP-HTS8562-12-crashing-Philips-Cinema-Gold-TV-(50PFL7956H-12).

The problem has finally been agnowledged (reproduced) by Philips and is under investigation. The issue exists on all 2011 Philips TV's.

There's something in the (Easylink) communication between the HTS and the TV that causes a reboot of the TV. During the reboot the HDMI-CEC bus is cleared (most of the times) which is also a wrong behaviour. After the reboot the TV starts in a weird mode in which not all functions are loaded.

Gerrit
09-04-2012, 10:51 AM
Hi Bluevoice, besides of the HTS incompatibility and the preset screen ratio format problem, are other problems solved now? Did 14.99 bring a good functioning local dimming and are the blacks as deep as they should be and no flashes anymore? Would you call the HD image of the 9956 perfect now?

bluevoice
09-04-2012, 02:22 PM
Hi Bluevoice, besides of the HTS incompatibility and the preset screen ratio format problem, are other problems solved now? Did 14.99 bring a good functioning local dimming and are the blacks as deep as they should be and no flashes anymore? Would you call the HD image of the 9956 perfect now?

@Gerrit: I never had flashes on my TV and the black is very deep with my settings (see a few posts earlier). The local dimming works fine as far as I'm concerned. I notice that the video source is also important, I only notice small local dimming glitches when the quality of the video is poor. When I play a Bluray for example, I can't notice any malfunction of the local dimming.

The 14.99 solved the annoying PNM bug, one of the last issues on my list. The last one is the HTS incompatibility bug, if they solve that one, the product would be more or less perfect. The image is great and it functions as it should.

I say more or less because I don't like how some functions were implemented in the 2011 line, especially the Dual-view screen (that works different than Phillips planned to make it eventually and also different than advertised). The Dual-view screen could have been a nice feature but I think Philips stopped development for this function halfway and it's really worthless like this. See also: http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?6014-Philips-please-remove-the-Multi-View-function-on-21-9-(misleading-advertising)

The second would be the possibility to record a TV broadcast without the use of internet. See also: http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?1786-Question-Why-is-the-IP-EPG-necessary-for-USB-Recording-in-2011-series

I'm affraid we'll never see this functions corrected as Philips focuses only on the 2012 line right now.

mduran
09-04-2012, 03:21 PM
No I do not have a HTS, or soundbar. Just Dreambox DM8000 and WD TV Live Streaming. Happens on both devices...

Gerrit
09-05-2012, 01:41 PM
Bluevoice: clear, and thanks for the reply.

mduran
09-05-2012, 05:33 PM
New problem appeared,

I I go from volume 17 to, let's say 22, it takes 5 seconds, volume icon appears on screen 17, stays there, and goes real slow to 18, 19, 20, 21 and eventually 22. Then it takes another 2 or 3 seconds before it to dissapear. In the meantime the volume is already at 22 but showing me 17.

Something must be wrong with the tv,

Teddy63
09-06-2012, 04:39 PM
New problem ,

Can't access to the service "SALTO" on HBBTV by click on the blue button .... Work very well to my friend who has a Samsung TV ...

Want a nex firmware pleaaaaaaase !! and more french apps on the Net tv ...!!

kingzapp
09-11-2012, 05:19 AM
I just got back my 9706 from philips. Nopp! They said DSE is on every 9706 tv's and they are not fixing it or have any idea how to fix it right now. Why do you sell them philips?!

zlatko
09-11-2012, 08:48 AM
@kingzapp
Such problems can happen, but it is bad that Philips didn't issue official statement that company is aware of DSE, but on most screens it is within specs and no change will be made. This silence leaves a bad taste in every 9 series owner, and these are premium model buyers. They will think twice choosing Philips again. Too bad only Philips can produce Ambilight models. So I will have to live with DSE in my 52PFL9606 until OLEDs start to more affordable and widely spread.

Lighthouse
09-12-2012, 11:03 AM
I find backlight scanning is better and black levels have improved on my tv.

There are 2 remaining issues here. Firstly, the tv image still flashes.

Update: White flash also occurs during tv-watching, internal coax cam, not only hdmi inputs.

I am sure this is related to the internal processing of the tv.

Secondly, the dual viewer is useless, as one can clearly see both sides, when gaming, so I have my friends image as my background. This must be possible to fix! Just separate the images properly in the processing! Philips-Thomas please alert your technicians.

Espen000
09-13-2012, 08:08 AM
Dear support/FW developers.

I have a theory regarding why the local dimming is still not working perfectly.

In some movies/series the production has used a sort of filter in the picture. I guess it is to make it "more cinematic". If you look at movies such as "The Grey" go to a scene where there is daylight and lots of white snow. You will notice in the picture that there are plenty of "black dots" even though the picture is white. Those "dots" are moving around too. So i guess using such a filter places a lot of information in the picture for the TV processor to process.

When there are dark scenes in this movie I would think that "black dot filter" is still on top of the darkness making it even more difficult to process accurate local dimming. My guess is that these dots or other movie filters causes the tv to struggle with the local dimming in some scenes.

I have seen that the movie "Casino Royale" also have this "black dots"-filter in it which is the other movie I see local dimming errors.

Could you guys at Philips try to replicate these findings in your lab? Maybe this could be a way to look further into these issues and how to cope with them?


Espen

hardsoft
09-14-2012, 09:27 PM
Yep, there are some behavioural issues still to fix. In my 58PFL9956 there are flashes, sometimes the CEC operation from TV remote doesn't work with BDP7600 (warm reboot helps) and there are annoying local dimming issues. For example in "Pacific" series in dimly lit cantine scenes the backgroud areas changes unevenly brightness continuously in larger areas as some bright spot in the picture ie. there's kind of general level dimming as well - which actually has led difficulties in dark scenes with subtitles....

Espen000
09-16-2012, 07:16 AM
Could anyone else try out "Hunger Games" on BluRay?

I watched the movie yesterday. The local dimming worked ok, but i have never seen the flashing issue been that agressive. In some scenes it was almost like there was constantly lightning...

weijte000
09-16-2012, 06:41 PM
My TV started to reboot again with 0.14.99.0 Don't know if it is the 2 hour bug or randomly. Happens every night. Picture goes blank, ambilight turns off, ambilight turns on, and picture appears again. 52pfl9606. This is not acceptable! I complained about this a few months back.


I have the same problem and it's not a 2 hour interval. I just got a new 52pfl9606, being a replacement.
The issue is very annoying and when watching TV (CI+ by Neotion) it start with the signal being interrupted a few times and then a reboot.
It's even worse when watching content via DLNA, a reboot happens within 5-10 minutes from starting to watch content, so the DLNA function is completely unusable. I didn't have this problem when using 14.93 but .96 and .99 are terrible.

By the way the Media player overall is very weak, slow scrolling, no memory of played upto, no start from a specific time etc. Unfortunately the WIFI signal from my PS3 is very bad so using the TV is my best option.

Espen000
09-21-2012, 10:43 AM
I have not received any response for my findings regarding the local dimming issues. It would be great if I at least got some confirmation that my findings has been forwarded to the development team or something.


I tried to look for some in-movie screens on the web from THe Grey to show better what I mean with those "black-dots"-filter they use that could affect the local dimming issues.

I found this picture which have high resolution. Note that in the white area there are lots of black dots. I think this makes the local dimming engine working overload (see my last post regarding this too)


http://www.highdefdiscnews.com/screenshots/the_grey_9.png


I also found a picture from Casino Royale where you see that same black-dot effect, but not as agressive:
http://cdn04.cdn.justjared.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/05/casino_royale_trailer/casino-royale-trailer03.jpg

BjornRuud
09-21-2012, 10:59 AM
@Espen000
The link to the first picture doesn't work. What are we looking for in the Casino Royale image? I can only find film grain, nothing out of the ordinary.

Espen000
09-21-2012, 11:03 AM
THe link works fine here. Try it with Google Chrome browser. Maybe our browser does not have support for .png files directly ?

You could also try right click and download the image.

And the film grain you refer to might the correct term for those black dots. But the grains are very extreme i "THe Grey". I think this could affect the local dimming.

BjornRuud
09-21-2012, 11:56 AM
I'm using Chrome. Clicking on the link takes me to an image with text that warns about hotlinking.

I'm not sure film grain alone is the problem. For instance the movie "300" has massive amounts of grain and that wasn't an issue on my 9706. Film grain (and analog picture noise) is so common that a firmware that doesn't handle it is close to useless. Then again, nothing would surprise me with Philips firmware.

willemcj
09-21-2012, 09:47 PM
I am not happy with this FW. I own a 32PFL9606 and use Ziggo CI+ and now I have, scince I downloaded it, occasionally disturbances in picture and sound for about 1 sec or less, on most channels, looking like the signal being to weak. But at a signal strength of 92 and a signal quality of 100% this cannot be the case. My other tv, a 32 PFL6007, does not show this behaviour and is working fine.

Philips
09-28-2012, 09:20 AM
I have the same problem and it's not a 2 hour interval. I just got a new 52pfl9606, being a replacement.
The issue is very annoying and when watching TV (CI+ by Neotion) it start with the signal being interrupted a few times and then a reboot.
It's even worse when watching content via DLNA, a reboot happens within 5-10 minutes from starting to watch content, so the DLNA function is completely unusable. I didn't have this problem when using 14.93 but .96 and .99 are terrible.

By the way the Media player overall is very weak, slow scrolling, no memory of played upto, no start from a specific time etc. Unfortunately the WIFI signal from my PS3 is very bad so using the TV is my best option.

Dear Weijte000,

Please check your PM folder. We want to get in contact with you, but we did not get a reaction sofar.

Regards,
JuAn

kookaburra
09-28-2012, 09:32 AM
New Firmware 14.101. What changes have been included?

google translator

inthehouse
09-28-2012, 09:36 AM
new Firmware please look here
http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?8057-Your-experiences-with-FW-14-101-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-%282011-models%29

I dont now how to make the Thread sticky.

bluevoice
09-28-2012, 04:06 PM
Hi all,

New software 14.101 available. Please continue in a new thread here:

http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?8083-Your-experiences-with-FW-v0-14-101-0-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-(2011-models)&p=41739#post41739

bluevoice
09-28-2012, 04:11 PM
new Firmware please look here
http://www.supportforum.philips.com/en/showthread.php?8057-Your-experiences-with-FW-14-101-for-8000-9000-and-21-9-series-%282011-models%29

I dont now how to make the Thread sticky.

Sorry, I double posted. Only the Philips mods can make a thread sticky. They can also delete one of the threads now. No need for double threads.