Results 1 to 7 of 7
  • Topic Tools
  • Display
  • Bookmark and Share
  1. #1
    Silver Member
    Points: 2,598, Level: 14
    Level completed: 50%, Points required for next Level: 152
    Overall activity: 15.0%
    Achievements:
    1000 Experience PointsNew Achievement!Veteran
    MartiniB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Riga, Latvia
    Posts
    50
    Points
    2,598
    Level
    14
    Thanks
    6
    Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Post Choose 46pfl9707s = my most expensive mistake?!

    A week ago I "upgraded" 42pfl9703h to 46pfl9707s
    and now I have several "who, why have things changed to the worse possible way?"

    1.
    Terrible viewing angles when compared with 42pfl9703h
    yes my fault, didn't focus attention on that important point


    2.
    TV keeps losing speakers when movable wall mount support is chosen:
    9703 has2x Left and 2x Right speakers on the back,
    9707 has zero speakers on the back and 1x Left and 1x Right in the stand.
    Why didn’t engineers leave at least a single left/right speaker on the back?
    (5x cheaper Philip's TVs can have that "extras")
    For me that isn't the biggest problem because under the tv I have an AV Receiver,
    but I have some women at home who think that it is complicated to turn on/off the Sat receiver and then the TV and now comes third device


    3.
    Lost Coaxial audio output
    coaxial cable is more flexible and analog audio cables can be used, which I have a lot,
    instead I had to order an extra optical cable.
    3.b
    Location of the Optical Audio output socket is not convenient, worse can be only on front panel.

    4.
    The TV can show the message "no signal" on the selected source, but doesn't go to standby after any minutes idle time
    20 years old CRTs were smarter.


    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	mainlogo_full_gb_en.gif 
Views:	49 
Size:	2.8 KB 
ID:	1842
    5.
    "Masterpiece" of Philips "Sense and Simplicity", just a few keys with the remote control

    Set 60 minutes `Sleep Timer` on 46pfl9707s:
    1. >>Options<< Dreambox's(think others too) remote control doesn't have that key
    2. >>Right<<
    3. >>Right<<
    4. >>Right<<
    5. >>Right<<
    6. >>Right<<
    7. >>Right<<
    8. >>Right<<
    9. >>Right<<
    10. >>Ok(Setup)<<
    11. >>Down<<
    12. >>Ok(TV settings)<<
    13. >>Down<<
    14. >>Down<<
    15. >>Down<<
    16. >>Down<<
    17. >>Ok(General settings)<<
    18. >>Down<<
    19. >>Down<<
    20. >>Ok(Sleep timer)<<
    21. >>Up(sleep 5 min)<<
    22. >>Up(sleep 10 min)<<
    23. >>Up(sleep 15 min)<<
    24. >>Up(sleep 20 min)<<
    25. >>Up(sleep 25 min)<<
    26. >>Up(sleep 30 min)<<
    27. >>Up(sleep 35 min)<<
    28. >>Up(sleep 40 min)<<
    29. >>Up(sleep 45 min)<<
    30. >>Up(sleep 50 min)<<
    31. >>Up(sleep 55 min)<<
    32. >>Up(sleep 60 min)<<
    33. >>Exit<< Dreambox's RC doesn't have that key, 2x >>Menu<< then helps
    or
    1. >>Menu<<
    2. >>Right<<
    3. >>Right<<
    4. >>Right<<
    5. >>Right<<
    6. >>Ok(Setup)<<
    7. >>Down<<
    8. >>Ok(TV settings)<<
    9. >>Down<<
    10. >>Down<<
    11. >>Down<<
    12. >>Down<<
    13. >>Ok(General settings)<<
    14. >>Down<<
    15. >>Down<<
    16. >>Ok(Sleep timer)<<
    17. >>Up(sleep 5 min)<<
    18. >>Up(sleep 10 min)<<
    19. >>Up(sleep 15 min)<<
    20. >>Up(sleep 20 min)<<
    21. >>Up(sleep 25 min)<<
    22. >>Up(sleep 30 min)<<
    23. >>Up(sleep 35 min)<<
    24. >>Up(sleep 40 min)<<
    25. >>Up(sleep 45 min)<<
    26. >>Up(sleep 50 min)<<
    27. >>Up(sleep 55 min)<<
    28. >>Up(sleep 60 min)<<
    29. >>Exit<< Dreambox's RC doesn't have that key, 2x >>Menu<< then helps

    Set 60 minutes `Sleep Timer` on 42pfl9703h:
    1. >>Menu<<
    _ (not necessary if the last visited section was `Features`)
    _ 2. >>Down<<
    _ 3. >>Down<<
    _ 4. >>Down<<
    _ 5. >>Down<<
    _ 6. >>Down<<
    7. >>Ok or Right(Features)<<
    8. >>Down<<
    9. >>Down<<
    10. >>Ok or Right(Sleeptimer)<<
    11. >>Up(sleep 5 min)<<
    12. >>Up(sleep 10 min)<<
    13. >>Up(sleep 15 min)<<
    14. >>Up(sleep 20 min)<<
    15. >>Up(sleep 25 min)<<
    16. >>Up(sleep 30 min)<<
    17. >>Up(sleep 35 min)<<
    18. >>Up(sleep 40 min)<<
    19. >>Up(sleep 45 min)<<
    20. >>Up(sleep 50 min)<<
    21. >>Up(sleep 55 min)<<
    22. >>Up(sleep 60 min)<<
    23. >>Menu<<

    few key press can be avoid just by return back ability wrap round in menu,
    this were forbidden after first firmware updates of **pfl9703*

    For example, how hard it is with Dreambox
    To set 60 minutes `Sleep Timer`:
    1. >>Menu<<
    2. >>Up or Right(to select last section in list)<<
    3. >>Ok(Standby / Restart)<<
    4. >>Ok(Sleep Timer)<<
    _ (not necessary if previous used value pass)
    _ 5. >>6<<
    _ 6. >>0<<
    7. >>Ok<<
    or
    1. >>Long press(3sec) Power<<
    2. >>Ok(Sleep Timer)<<
    _ (not necessary if previous used value pass)
    _ 3. >>6<<
    _ 4. >>0<<
    5. >>Ok<<


    6.
    Move picture option:
    with 42pfl9703h it were direct on Up/Down/Left/Right keys
    with 46pfl9707s it is 20+ steps deep in menu
    6.b
    Move picture doesn't work when `Screen edges` is set to 0
    with 42pfl9703h move works also in `Unscaled` mode, just not needed area goes out of screen and from the other side comes a black bar.


    7.
    Option set audio volume correction for particular inputs and services is gone.
    but who cares about that if TV doesn't contain speakers
    and to digital audio output singnal goes without correction


    8.
    42pfl9703h has a universal remote control
    46pfl9707s doesn't


    9.
    Why invent new Remote Control buttons and leave already presented without job?
    For example, `OK` button on 42pfl9703h opens sources+services list - what was wrong with it?
    What was the reason to "improve" it?!
    Now a new button `LIST` is invented which you will never find on other brand's remote controls and on the previous Philip's remotes too.


    10.
    Button `Return` can't switch between sources and tv services.


    11.
    Autozoom doesn't push out channel's logos if they are in the black area.


    12.
    incorrect Latvian characters in EPG.


    13.
    not supported Diseq protocol 1.1 and cascade, most last ~ten years setupboxes support it
    yes, my first digital STB D-Box1 Nokia 9500 didn't (in far 1997)


    14.
    the TV has the console below, but operation buttons somewhy located on the back

  2. #2
    Bronze Member
    Points: 2,202, Level: 13
    Level completed: 18%, Points required for next Level: 248
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    1 year registered1000 Experience PointsNew Achievement!
    Contour66's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    France
    Posts
    19
    Points
    2,202
    Level
    13
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    Rep Power
    0
    Hi MartiniB,

    Quite a list. I reply here because I also had a 9703 before I bought the 8007 (same family as your 9707). Did u read the User Manual? I ask because some of your questions could easily be found there....

    1. Maybe a smaller viewing angle (didn't compare spec's), but you now have superb black levels and contrast compared to your old TV. I myself find that more important than the viewing angle: from what angle do u normally watch TV? You normally sit in front of it right?
    I experienced with my 8007 that the initial picture settings made the pictures a bit "light hazed", so I re-aligned it and set most picture improvement features to MIN or OFF. Made it much better! Maybe that is also influencing your angle complaint?

    2. This TV has a stand with built-in speakers. That is a design choice of course, now the TV can be made thinner and the sound better. Another great feature of this stand is that you can mount it “up-side-down” to the TV and then it can be used as a wall-mount. So, no need for an expensive extra wall mount!

    3. That is a design choice.

    4. Read the User Manual: "If you do not press a key on the remote control during a 4 hour period, or if the TV receives no input signal and receives no remote control commands for 10 minutes, the TV switches off automatically to save energy.
    If you use the TV as a monitor or use a digital receiver to watch TV (a Set-top box - STB) and you do not use the remote control of the TV, you should deactivate the automatic switch off.
    To deactivate, press Home, select Setup and press OK. Select TV settings > General settings > Switch off timer and set the slider bar to 0."

    5. 1st: You cannot seriously expect from Philips (or any other brand) that they make TV’s or RC’s that are compatible with all other brands/models (like Dreambox)! Or?
    2nd: If you select HOME and then use the “CH+/-“ button, you need only 2 pushes instead of 6 to go to “Configuration”.

    6. Agree. There’s room for improvement. But I myself never use that feature, how many (standard users) do use it?

    7. Don’t know exactly what you mean here, but all kind of corrections can be normally made in the Home Theater System if you use optical output. Also some in the TV.

    8. The 9707 has an RF remote control, which has other advantages, like no need to point to TV, it has a full keyboard (which the 9703 does not have), pointer, etc. Again this is a matter of choice. Just use the RC that comes with the device.
    BTW, the 9707 is still compatible with IR signals, and the 9703 had a terrible scrolling wheel feature…

    9. That is called progress….Why does your old TV have a plastic rim, and your new a metal one… Why is your old TV thicker than your new one, etc., etc. Sometimes the “marketeers” have a bigger say in this then the technicians…

    10. Please explain what you mean here?

    11. No product is without flaws. Maybe room for improvement via SW update.

    12. Maybe room for improvement via SW update. No product is without flaws.

    13. Read the specifications before buying?

    14. Design choice: most customers 2day want to see a clean front without too much buttons.
    BTW: your old TV had the keyboard on the side, also not on the front….


    I really hope that you can enjoy your new TV a bit more now, as (I think) it is an awesome product. I would have bought it, but it was unfortunately too expensive for me :-(
    Last edited by Contour66; 04-11-2013 at 01:33 PM.

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to Contour66 For This Useful Post:

    chrisham (04-11-2013)

  4. #3
    Silver Member
    Points: 2,598, Level: 14
    Level completed: 50%, Points required for next Level: 152
    Overall activity: 15.0%
    Achievements:
    1000 Experience PointsNew Achievement!Veteran
    MartiniB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Riga, Latvia
    Posts
    50
    Points
    2,598
    Level
    14
    Thanks
    6
    Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts
    Rep Power
    4
    @Contour66
    Thanks for answer

    0.
    user manual is read

    1.
    yeah, black level now are perfect when sit direct to the TV - ~20-30 degree
    but on higher angles black becomes lot whither and colors also goes to ~PCs 8bit~ mode
    from my tv time i sit direct to tv only some 30%, other time i am somewhere near in a flat
    when sit at PC table and look to tv i have angle ~140 degree
    from breakfast/dinner table some ~100 degree
    and from that big angles picture is lot worse, like trough cheesecloth

    2.
    speakers in stand - idea is great,
    but it must come as additional feature to improve sound from the back and not disable it at all
    2.b
    presented wall mount can't be compared with my current Vogel's EFW 6345

    3.
    bad choice,
    and as i know optical take signal from coaxial

    4.
    have read a manual, tv doesn't switch off also after 65 minutes `No video signal`

    5.
    this is not about compatibility, but compare between complicate and easy setup
    important options are too deep
    there are several suggestions:
    a) enable wrap round in menu sections
    b) change main menu single line style to two or tree lines
    b+) enable pointer in menu sections
    c) some new user configurable shortcuts section on colored button

    6.
    i prefer use overscan(Screen edges=0) as less as possible,
    for 95% of content this is ok, but sometime i need push out some technical lines at top of the screen
    with previous Philips TV that were directly accessible
    and deepness of section is less important than move doesn't work with zero overscan and unscalled

    7.
    **pfl***3*(2008) have option `Delta volume`
    in my neighbor's 40pfl5604h(2009) it was gone, but i though it because middle class of tv range

    8.
    now have to operate with two remotes
    Dreambox dm8000 as one of first HD box have only DVI output where HDMI CEC isn't possible
    but currently no other Dreambox's model present with four tuner modules - two dvb-s2 and two dvb-t
    and my AV receiver is outmoded too, Yamaha RX-V661, which HDMI 1.2 doesn't support audio return channel and CEC

    9.
    yes, progress...

    10.
    switch back to previous input source from tv service or back

    11.
    i think previous tv check blackbars somewhere at middle of picture and then logos are ignored exception when they have some movement
    hope also for 16:9 sources can be returned,
    still have few broadcasters who provide all side blackbars
    http://www.supportforum.philips.com/...ll=1#post35815

    12.
    some are well, some not

    13.
    have read, in case i have a Dreambox that isn't big deal, there are 24x LNBs connected
    just Philips TV looks little oldish

    14.
    side buttons were accessible easier, thankful i still haven't had to access keys on the backpanel


    yes, i also think tv is lot overpriced, ~20% at least - it isn't 1/3 better than 8k models
    reason can be Philips not interested on high sales cause Sharp can't produce enough matrix

  5. #4
    Bronze Member
    Points: 916, Level: 7
    Level completed: 83%, Points required for next Level: 34
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    New Achievement!Tagger Second Class500 Experience Points1 year registered

    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    34
    Points
    916
    Level
    7
    Thanks
    16
    Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    I totally agree the ability to wrap round in menus should be enabled again! I also cannot think of any good reason to leave it out. Anyone does? Philips, can you clarify why that is blocked/disabled?

    tnanks.

  6. #5
    Moderator
    Points: 75,585, Level: 85
    Level completed: 44%, Points required for next Level: 965
    Overall activity: 30.0%
    Achievements:
    Recommendation First ClassTagger First Class50000 Experience PointsNew Achievement!Veteran
    Philips's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    810
    Points
    75,585
    Level
    85
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 15 Times in 13 Posts
    Rep Power
    10
    Quote Originally Posted by DadGommit View Post
    I totally agree the ability to wrap round in menus should be enabled again! I also cannot think of any good reason to leave it out. Anyone does? Philips, can you clarify why that is blocked/disabled?

    tnanks.
    Hi,

    No idea. That was also one of the things we reported back to development, but it will probably not land anymore in this model range . Unfortunately.....

    Regards,
    JuAn
    Forum Mod

  7. #6
    Bronze Member
    Points: 916, Level: 7
    Level completed: 83%, Points required for next Level: 34
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    New Achievement!Tagger Second Class500 Experience Points1 year registered

    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    34
    Points
    916
    Level
    7
    Thanks
    16
    Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Philips View Post
    Hi,

    No idea. That was also one of the things we reported back to development, but it will probably not land anymore in this model range . Unfortunately.....

    Regards,
    JuAn
    Hi JuAn,

    Thanks for your swift reply. What makes you think this can/will not be brought about in 2012-models anymore? (I own 46PFL8007 myself) It is one of the quite easily feasible improvements that will give many people that complain about slow menu's a much nicer menu operating experience. I think PHILIPS/TPV Development and perhaps moreover Marketing should not forget (or rather be worried) about the truckloads of unhappy 2012-model owners. The people that tell friends and family what TV-set they should or should not buy...

  8. #7
    Moderator
    Points: 75,585, Level: 85
    Level completed: 44%, Points required for next Level: 965
    Overall activity: 30.0%
    Achievements:
    Recommendation First ClassTagger First Class50000 Experience PointsNew Achievement!Veteran
    Philips's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    810
    Points
    75,585
    Level
    85
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 15 Times in 13 Posts
    Rep Power
    10
    Hi DadGommit,

    I own a 55PFL8007 myself and found it also "unhandy" in the beginning, but now I'm used to it, and I can life with it (as a user).

    Regards,
    JuAn
    Forum Mod

Similar Topics

  1. Songbird DIED - is my expensive GoGear Connect 3 now useless?
    By DIJK in forum Sound: GoGear SA3-series (2011)
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 02-20-2013, 01:34 PM
  2. 46pfl9707s/12
    By EdwinM in forum TV: Share Your Reviews
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 01-16-2013, 03:58 PM
  3. 3D source, what to choose?
    By Eburd in forum TV: 3D
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-12-2012, 09:48 AM
  4. How choose audio-track from usb
    By jorekami in forum TV: Streaming & Network
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 11-26-2012, 06:18 PM
  5. HTS9140/12 Easylink: cannot choose configuration menu
    By bugmenot in forum Sound: Sound Bar (1.1 system)
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 06-05-2012, 11:08 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •